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E46 M3 (2001-2006) Engine: S54 - Max Hp: 333 hp at 7,900 rpm / 262 lb/ft at 4,900 rpm
Total Produced: 45,000+ - Years Produced: 2001 to 2006.


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Old Sat, Jun-08-2019, 02:41:54 AM   #11
whips333
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Let us know what your buddy with the cams puts down now that his vanos issue has been resolved.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HassanEido View Post
So the past few days I've been battling vanos issues fixing a couple of friends cars in our local community. And I think I've got some interesting information for u guys so I thought I'd share.
-The first car got cammed(280 272 cat cams).
After the cam install we did a vanos test and it failed intake advance at 340ms. So we measured the vanos pressure and it was 60bars(115 required). We changed the vanos pressure valve and it went up to 80 bars. Still down on pressure. The owner had forgotten to install the pressure relief valves in the cat cams from his original cams. We did that and retimed the car and the pressure gauge needle was pegged at 160 bars lol. We had to dial it back to 115. Success.
-the second car has stock cams, but had unknown vanos oil pressure and was suffering an abysmal low end, no codes.
We measured its pressure it read 40 bars.. 40! It then proceeded to go down to a record breaking 20 bars when at operating temp. Yep u read that right. We changed vanos pressure valves and max it got was 60 bars. Still way way way down. We ordered a set or vanos seals thinking we will need those.
Just for kicks we installed a known to be good solinoid pack, started the car expecting nothing special, to my surprise the pressure was pegged at 140 again on a cold start then started to go down to 90bars at idle and 115 bars at 2k rpms.
Conclusion :if your new pressure valve doesn't get the vanos oil pressure up to spec, try the vanos solinoid pack also. If you're getting cams, make sure u have cam shaft relief valves in there before u install them.
The seals we ordered are going in the drawer for now... No need for those now.
Cheers
Hassan
Sent from my LGMP260 using Tapatalk
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Old Sat, Jun-08-2019, 02:56:27 AM   #12
mrgizmo04
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

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Originally Posted by Nambo View Post
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'85 528e 164k miles (sold)
'05 M3 6MT coupe

All DIY: VANOS, WPC rod bearings, full SS (SS stepped V1 headers, catted S1, stock S2, SS sport), AFD E85 Proflex kit, Ohlins R&T/Hyperco 375f Swift 672r/GC street tops and camber plates, ST40 355 pfc08, 330 ZHP steering rack, diffsonline 4.1 diff with rem polish, E60 short shifter lever, AKG black diff bushings/subframe bushings, Rogue rtab, Sachs clutch/flywheel, rear main, Beyer driveshaft, valve adjustment, cooling refresh.

Happy to help with VANOS or any other DIY job around NorCal. Have various specialty tools (VANOS, RTAB, engine bar, valve adjustment, tranny jack, ball joint separator, pilot bearing puller, tap&die kit, etc).
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Old Sat, Jun-08-2019, 04:59:11 AM   #13
HassanEido
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Quote:
Originally Posted by whips333 View Post
Let us know what your buddy with the cams puts down now that his vanos issue has been resolved.

Sent from my LGMP260 using Tapatalk
He put down 347whp
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Mods:
-Custom CF airbox
-SSV2 catless headers(with a modified collector extention), Custom 2.5" dual sec1, Custom sec2 2.5" dual with e9xM X pipe, SuperSprint Race inspired custom section 3..
-Cat Cams 280 272.
-Custom dyno tune
-Tms pulleys and electric fan conversion
385.7 whp 288 wtq

Custom exhaust thread and dyno http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=569086
Cams thread and dyno http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=554439
Custom cf airbox thread http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=595180
Why not to use after market bearings with surfacetreatments and /or increased clearance
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showp...4&postcount=10
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Old Wed, Jun-12-2019, 01:45:45 AM   #14
sapote
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Quote:
Originally Posted by HassanEido View Post
Conclusion :if your new pressure valve doesn't get the vanos oil pressure up to spec, try the vanos solinoid pack also. If you're getting cams, make sure u have cam shaft relief valves in there before u install them.
The relief valve in the cam has nothing to do with VANOS oil pressure. Cam relief valve is for controlling the oil supply for lubricating the spline gears and the axial bearings.
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Old Sat, Jun-15-2019, 11:44:22 PM   #15
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

So after my Dbilas 288/280 cam swap I had pretty bad Vanos response, but only in the advance direction, on both cams. Retard was mostly normal. I'm using a standalone ECU so I don't have a "Vanos response test" but can easily log the Vanos performance. Finally got a pressure tester from a member on here and saw some interesting results..

On a cold start, I saw max of 100bar, dropped to about 85 warmed up. I adjusted it up to 110-115 hot. However, when I try and move/advance the cams (like what would happen during a Vanos test) the pressure drops way down, to below 40 bar.

I assume this isn't normal? Has anyone watched the Vanos pressure during a Vanos test, or at least while revving up the engine or putting it under a bit of load?

This makes me think that either there's insufficient oil supply (I'm using a BW oil feed line) or that there's an internal pressure leakage (maybe seals)? I have a full Beisan Vanos rebuild, although the solenoid pack/sealing plate etc hasn't been touched for a couple years now. Guess I'll be pulling that apart to inspect it and clean out the valve bodies again.
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///BBRTuning | 2001 LSB M3 6MT | AEM Infinity + flex fuel | JE 11.5/Carillo S54 | Streamline CSL box | Dbilas 288/280 cams | Moton 3WR rear coilover, 700/500 | Stoptech Trophy BBK 6F/4R | Slicer-spec BBS RIA Japan 18x10.5 et22 (x4) | BMW M 4.10 | Turner monoball FCAB/RTABs | Turner lower-rear + Wisefab upper arms | Z3 rack | Lang Racing CF roof | full interior 3310lb wet
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Old Sun, Jun-16-2019, 01:42:10 AM   #16
eacmen
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Anyone running an electronic pressure sender for the VANOS to a data logger or cabin gauge? $250 seems steep for an analog gauge you need to remove.
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Old Sun, Jun-16-2019, 02:43:28 AM   #17
sapote
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBRTuning View Post
So after my Dbilas 288/280 cam swap I had pretty bad Vanos response, but only in the advance direction, on both cams. Retard was mostly normal. I'm using a standalone ECU so I don't have a "Vanos response test" but can easily log the Vanos performance. Finally got a pressure tester from a member on here and saw some interesting results..

On a cold start, I saw max of 100bar, dropped to about 85 warmed up. I adjusted it up to 110-115 hot. However, when I try and move/advance the cams (like what would happen during a Vanos test) the pressure drops way down, to below 40 bar.

I assume this isn't normal? Has anyone watched the Vanos pressure during a Vanos test, or at least while revving up the engine or putting it under a bit of load?

This makes me think that either there's insufficient oil supply (I'm using a BW oil feed line) or that there's an internal pressure leakage (maybe seals)? I have a full Beisan Vanos rebuild, although the solenoid pack/sealing plate etc hasn't been touched for a couple years now. Guess I'll be pulling that apart to inspect it and clean out the valve bodies again.
pressure dropped too fast during Vanos response could due to discharged accumulator
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Old Sun, Jun-16-2019, 12:33:51 PM   #18
Leipzig
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Quote:
Originally Posted by sapote View Post
The relief valve in the cam has nothing to do with VANOS oil pressure. Cam relief valve is for controlling the oil supply for lubricating the spline gears and the axial bearings.

But your oilpressure will not build up properly without the valve. And if that happens, the high pressure pump inside the Vanos donít get enough oil.
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Old Sun, Jun-16-2019, 01:21:07 PM   #19
HassanEido
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leipzig View Post
But your oilpressure will not build up properly without the valve. And if that happens, the high pressure pump inside the Vanos donít get enough oil.
Yes. It creates an internal leak in the system.
__________________

Mods:
-Custom CF airbox
-SSV2 catless headers(with a modified collector extention), Custom 2.5" dual sec1, Custom sec2 2.5" dual with e9xM X pipe, SuperSprint Race inspired custom section 3..
-Cat Cams 280 272.
-Custom dyno tune
-Tms pulleys and electric fan conversion
385.7 whp 288 wtq

Custom exhaust thread and dyno http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=569086
Cams thread and dyno http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=554439
Custom cf airbox thread http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=595180
Why not to use after market bearings with surfacetreatments and /or increased clearance
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showp...4&postcount=10
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Old Sun, Jun-16-2019, 06:05:43 PM   #20
sapote
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Default Re: Vanos pressure woes and solutions

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leipzig View Post
But your oilpressure will not build up properly without the valve. And if that happens, the high pressure pump inside the Vanos donít get enough oil.
Again the cam relief valve has nothing to do with Vanos pre-pump or post-pump oil regulating. The prepump lower pressure regulator is inside the Vanos and not in the cam as some people think.
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Discussing Vanos pressure woes and solutions in the E46 M3 (2001-2006) Forum - Engine: S54 - Max Hp: 333 hp at 7,900 rpm / 262 lb/ft at 4,900 rpm
Total Produced: 45,000+ - Years Produced: 2001 to 2006. at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)