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E46 M3 (2001-2006) Engine: S54 - Max Hp: 333 hp at 7,900 rpm / 262 lb/ft at 4,900 rpm
Total Produced: 45,000+ - Years Produced: 2001 to 2006.


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Old Sat, Jun-01-2019, 02:37:21 AM   #341
fastsoup
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SMG cog light View Post
No. That seal is for the actual PUMP inside the unit. The seals where I find most of the leaks are from the solenoid valves. They are O rings. (refer to smg maintenance thread pictures and links). What I typically do is replace every single O ring and also that PUMP seal that you mentioned. This way I know for sure that all of my internal seals have been replaced. It would suck if you only replaced the PUMP seals and it still leaks,; but from the solenoid valves. Also if you only replace the solenoid seals, it might leak from the PUMP seals. This is why you should just replace all Internal seals since you are in there. And you don't have to do it again for another 50,000 - 100,000 miles. And they are inexpensive.

Fair enough. I'll buy this kit, and look at the maintenance thread and buy the others.
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Old Mon, Jun-10-2019, 09:59:43 PM   #342
fastsoup
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

I tried to do the pressure accumulator test using the foxwell scanner. Not exactly sure if I did it correctly but it says I have 12psi? If this is the case, why would my pump hold decent pressure?
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Old Mon, Jun-10-2019, 10:10:02 PM   #343
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

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Originally Posted by fastsoup View Post
I tried to do the pressure accumulator test using the foxwell scanner. Not exactly sure if I did it correctly but it says I have 12psi? If this is the case, why would my pump hold decent pressure?
that is an incorrect reading. It will always say 12 psi unless all of the ideal conditions are met.

1. Accumulator has more than 1000 km on it.
2. Hydraulic temperature has to be between 20-40 C
3. No air in the lines and no internal or external leaks

Internal and external leaks will always prevent the psi test on accumulator on foxwell scanner. (the only time i was able to get the test working on the scanner was to fix the leaks and do a very thorough bleed.) one of the hydraulic lines on the flare nut was not tight on the HCU body.)
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Old Fri, Jun-14-2019, 05:59:47 PM   #344
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

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Originally Posted by Dr M3an M3 View Post
Sure thing. Send me some instructional steps to work off of and I'm glad to.
Did you ever get around to doing this?
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Old Sat, Jun-29-2019, 03:17:11 PM   #345
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SMG cog light View Post
The fact that you are getting 15-19 mins decay on a cold fluid only means that your accumulator is able to hold pressure. The 2 mins decay is a sign of some type of internal leak. I haven't seen an accumulator that only leaked at high temps. It was either always good or always bad (no nitrogen). The 2 smg pump reconditions (new seals) was able to hold 10 mins on one and 15 minutes on the other in cold fluid. That only means that the accumulator is in good shape. If your pressure is decaying faster than that in cold fluid, that means your accumulator is shot. Now when the temp of the smg fluid gets hotter and hotter; this is where it posses a problem. Hot temperature fluid is known to leak fluid in between solenoid valve seals. The reason I was able to find this out was by chance. The same 2 m3's mentioned above had all of it's original accumulator. The only thing I did was take all of the pump internals apart and replace any O rings or rubber seals I can find. I cleaned everything up also. After I put everything back together, It still primed 10 mins and 15 mins on each car. (was to be expected since it was same accumulator) The thing i noticed was after normal operating temperature ,(120-140 F) The pressure decay was 10 minutes on one, and 12 minutes on the other car. Both cars was able to shift 5-6 times before the motor came on again. Before the seals were replaced, the pressure decayed in 4 minutes on both cars. Neither car had the smg relocated.

I did a 3rd car pump recondition but didn't get to test it since I was unaware of the high temp leaks . This was the very 1st m3 I did a smg recondition for. I am now doin a 4th smg pump recondition this weekend. This time with a brand new motor, new burkhart fluid, new temp sensor, all new seals, and a new accumulator. The pump will also be relocated to the drug bin. I will make sure I will test the before and after pressure decays, to get some data to compare to everyone in this forum and the previous M3's that I did.

I will keep you posted. But based on the data, you seem to be leaking internally at high temperatures. This means that your car will drive fine in the winter and also the motor will prime less in the winter and you will get very good pressure decay times in the winter since the clod will keep the oil thick. And since it's thicker in the cold, it wont leak through the seals. It seems to leak through the seals around 160+ F. Also i forgot to mention that the 2 m3's with new seals oil temp never got higher than 150 F. This tells me that the motor is priming less in between pressure decays. Your temp of 170's is telling me that your motor is coming on too often between pressure decay. This correlates with the pressure decay data you provided. 2 mins motor coming on to prime is too often. And the more often / or sooner the motor comes on, the hotter it makes the fluid. Pressure builds heat.

I will pay very close attention to the before and after of this next smg pump recondition and will post my findings here.


How did the rebuild of that pump go? I've been thinking lots about this reply and really want to remove the pump and replace ALL the seals to the unit. Any chance there is a step by step DIY for this, or because you've done a few, you could maybe make one?
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Old Sat, Jun-29-2019, 03:22:31 PM   #346
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

Are these all the correct seals we need to change?

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/2000-2006-BM...-/183853194407

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/2000-2006-BM...IAAOSw~7Jcv--u

Or simply just buy this kit?

https://www.ebay.ca/itm/2000-2006-BM...gAAOSwFmxaYMai
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Old Sat, Jun-29-2019, 03:25:30 PM   #347
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

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Originally Posted by fastsoup View Post

This kit does not include the solenoid seals or the seal for the temp sensor. That price is also insane.
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Old Sat, Jun-29-2019, 04:37:15 PM   #348
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

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Originally Posted by Distinct70 View Post
This kit does not include the solenoid seals or the seal for the temp sensor. That price is also insane.
Temp sensor was just replaced with the Burkhurt kit.

Where would you recommend buying from?
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Old Sat, Jun-29-2019, 05:20:44 PM   #349
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

Smg Pump Gear Shaft Repair Seals.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sha...2&share_type=t
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Old Sun, Jun-30-2019, 09:00:40 PM   #350
fastsoup
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Default Re: I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not.

Response from eBay seller below...is this all the seals I'll need?

Hello,
Thanks for your interest and I can offer you the following SMG2 replacement parts.

1. viton seal/o-ring kit for inner Bosch pump
2. viton o-ring kit for solenoids

3.gear shaft replacement kit for inner Bosch pump (requires advance knowledge of SMG2 with sanding skill)


I have customers experience internal leakage even with a new smg motor, there are a few possibilities.

There are two gear shafts inside the Bosch pump. A gear shaft with bad teeth can not provide smooth rotation which is driven by the motor regardless how healthy is the motor. As well as the pressure accumulator, the system itself is complicated. I have those parts in stock for immediate delivery to Canada, let me know, thanks
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Discussing I think it's the SMG pump...hopefully not. in the E46 M3 (2001-2006) Forum - Engine: S54 - Max Hp: 333 hp at 7,900 rpm / 262 lb/ft at 4,900 rpm
Total Produced: 45,000+ - Years Produced: 2001 to 2006. at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)