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E36 M3 (1992-1999) {Euro - S50 B32 321hp @ 7400 rpm} {U.S. - S52 B32 240 hp @ 6000 rpm}
Total Produced: 71,212 - Years Produced: 1992 to 1999


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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 12:08:16 AM   #1
thirtysixnick
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Default Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

So two nights ago I decided to romp my M3/4/5 onto the highway and instead of going from third gear into fourth I went back into second gear at nearly full throttle. I completely released the clutch for probably a second/second and a half and it bounced at 8 grand maybe twice/three times. After doing this I put it back into forth and then down into fifth gear, it drove fine until the check engine light came on a few minutes later and then it started giving minor surges of power when driving after I had to go into neutral and launch it again. I pulled off onto the side of the road and had a tow company come and tow it back to my house, where it now sits in the garage.

I read the check engine light and got codes: P0300, P0304, and P0305.
P0300 = Random/Multiple Cylinder Misfire Detected
P0304 = Cylinder 4 Misfire Detected
P0305 = Cylinder 5 Misfire Detected


So my question is, what's probably broken??

Could it be something as small as the spark plugs, or did I bend a valve or something worse?

I just put in new spark plugs probably 2,000 miles ago so the plugs aren't aged or anything, but the ignition coils have no record of being changed since my ownership and the car does have 160k so
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 12:22:12 AM   #2
j0rdan J
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

Compression test it. If the numbers are low, then its likely a bent intake valve. You can leak down test the engine to verify which valve and what exactly has failed
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 12:42:06 AM   #3
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH



I would probably pull the plugs and take a look before I tried to turn it over. Get ahold of a scope and look around. Any damage will probably be obvious. If it looks OK I'd try to turn it over by hand before using the starter.


Better safe than sorry. Good luck OP
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 01:09:57 AM   #4
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

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Originally Posted by j0rdan J View Post
Compression test it. If the numbers are low, then its likely a bent intake valve. You can leak down test the engine to verify which valve and what exactly has failed
This.

The same thing happened to a friend of mine. We were doing some pulls on the highway and our cars were side by side. I had my windows open, we were at the top of 3rd, and I heard him let the clutch out in 2nd when I went down into 4th. His car sounded like a Honda for a second.

Another friend behind us said he saw sparks flying out of the exhaust or coming from under the car when it happened.

Most of the exhaust valves were bent as a result of it. I saw them and they weren't bent much. I'd think you would have a hard time seeing it with a scope. Compression / leak down will show it immediately.

My advice:
Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine over by hand. If that goes ok either compression test or leak down test it.
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 01:27:46 AM   #5
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

I unfortunately did the same exact thing on my 1995 M3. It was my first manual car

I did not bend a valve but the valve spring and retainer was shot. We ended up pulling the head off and replacing the valve/ spring/ retainer & 3 angle valve job on all the valves.

I wish you the best of luck. Worst case is not only your valves are bent, but the top of the pistons are damaged
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 01:40:13 AM   #6
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

I'm afraid money shifting these motors guarantees bent valves.
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 02:18:42 AM   #7
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

Pull the coils check resistances across the set. If they are all even, proceed to take out the spark plugs and look at those for any breakage, etc. If the coils are not even, proceed but keep the fact that they aren't helping in mind. Then, turn the motor over by hand a few times, feel out any resistance that feels abnormal. If nothing does, check compression. If compression is low in one or more non-adjacent cylinders, then scope the chambers and address those ones. If there is reduced compression in two adjacent cylinders and they are even, but lower than the other cylinders, you probably blew a head gasket between the cylinders - unlikely, but possible. Report back! The safest course of action is not touch anything and pull the head to see what happened. That way, you won't have any doubts and won't cause any additional damage.
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 03:34:56 AM   #8
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

Quote:
Originally Posted by j0rdan J View Post
Compression test it. If the numbers are low, then its likely a bent intake valve. You can leak down test the engine to verify which valve and what exactly has failed
I plan to pull the plugs tomorrow or Tuesday and also get a compression test in. I'm unsure of how to do a leak down so any links to a guide or should I just google it? LOL

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Originally Posted by propchef View Post


I would probably pull the plugs and take a look before I tried to turn it over. Get ahold of a scope and look around. Any damage will probably be obvious. If it looks OK I'd try to turn it over by hand before using the starter.


Better safe than sorry. Good luck OP
Appreciate the wishes.

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Originally Posted by fiveightandten View Post
This.

The same thing happened to a friend of mine. We were doing some pulls on the highway and our cars were side by side. I had my windows open, we were at the top of 3rd, and I heard him let the clutch out in 2nd when I went down into 4th. His car sounded like a Honda for a second.

Another friend behind us said he saw sparks flying out of the exhaust or coming from under the car when it happened.

Most of the exhaust valves were bent as a result of it. I saw them and they weren't bent much. I'd think you would have a hard time seeing it with a scope. Compression / leak down will show it immediately.

My advice:
Pull the plugs and try to turn the engine over by hand. If that goes ok either compression test or leak down test it.
My car sounded like a honda/some sort of motor cycle when it bounced, most horrible sound I've ever heard.

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Originally Posted by cowboyM3 View Post
I unfortunately did the same exact thing on my 1995 M3. It was my first manual car

I did not bend a valve but the valve spring and retainer was shot. We ended up pulling the head off and replacing the valve/ spring/ retainer & 3 angle valve job on all the valves.

I wish you the best of luck. Worst case is not only your valves are bent, but the top of the pistons are damaged
Going to say my car is somewhere similar along these lines. How much did all of that cost? Is it DIY'able to somewhere with average mechanical skill?

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Originally Posted by englishtom1596q View Post
I'm afraid money shifting these motors guarantees bent valves.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tykluss18 View Post
Pull the coils check resistances across the set. If they are all even, proceed to take out the spark plugs and look at those for any breakage, etc. If the coils are not even, proceed but keep the fact that they aren't helping in mind. Then, turn the motor over by hand a few times, feel out any resistance that feels abnormal. If nothing does, check compression. If compression is low in one or more non-adjacent cylinders, then scope the chambers and address those ones. If there is reduced compression in two adjacent cylinders and they are even, but lower than the other cylinders, you probably blew a head gasket between the cylinders - unlikely, but possible. Report back! The safest course of action is not touch anything and pull the head to see what happened. That way, you won't have any doubts and won't cause any additional damage.
Appreciate all the knowledge I'll DEFINITELY report back with what I figure out. Also loved your car on TST haha.

ALSO: to everyone telling me not to crank it over now; I started the car after about an hour of sitting on the side of the freeway, and the only thing noticeably wrong was a (moderately) low idle, and it felt like it was misfiring (d'UHHHH) . The idle sat at about 400, which is about 100 less than the usual 500, and the engine itself made no strange noises, didn't smoke, no overheating, no leaks, or anything else that would spook the regular enthusiast.
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 12:11:35 PM   #9
fiveightandten
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirtysixnick View Post
I plan to pull the plugs tomorrow or Tuesday and also get a compression test in. I'm unsure of how to do a leak down so any links to a guide or should I just google it? LOL
You need a leakdown tester and an air compressor. You can google it, as it's pretty standard. The only real variances are how much pressure people use, and whether or not they keep the plugs in.

If you have a compression tester, start there, as that will give you helpful information. If you have low compression anywhere, you can leakdown to find out where, or just pull the head and get a surprise. For a leakdown you're basically pressurizing the cylinder and listening for where the air is escaping. A bent intake valve will make it leak into the intake manifold. If you have a bent exhaust valve, you'll hear it hissing out of the exhaust. Bad rings will yield hissing into the crank case (you can hear that out the dipstick tube).

They sell leakdown test kits at Harbor Freight for pretty cheap. That kit works ok.
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Old Mon, Mar-13-2017, 12:36:35 PM   #10
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Default Re: Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH

If it is not idling smoothly you likely have a bent valve or two. I'd do a compression test. I did this last year unfortunately. I was able to spend some money on a performance head, but if you can't do everything at least look into a multi angle valve job to see if it is some thing you can afford, assuming you are into performance.
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Discussing Money Shift Into Second Around 70 MPH in the E36 M3 (1992-1999) Forum - {Euro - S50 B32 321hp @ 7400 rpm} {U.S. - S52 B32 240 hp @ 6000 rpm}
Total Produced: 71,212 - Years Produced: 1992 to 1999 at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)