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E90 M3 (Sedan) | E92 M3 (Coupe) | E93 M3 (Convertible) (2008-2013) {Engine: S65 - Max Hp: 414 hp (420 hp Euro) at 8,300 rpm / 295 lb/ft at 3,900 rpm}


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Old Fri, Dec-02-2016, 12:55:47 PM   #41
Rez
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

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Originally Posted by admranger View Post
Let me f'n google that for you... BE Bearings Website

And the answer is yes, I'm comfortable enough that I have a set in my S65 right now. I sure as hell don't trust the numbskulls at BMW who have screwed it up on two generations of M3s and at least one generation of M5's.


Not sure who ate your cookie but your miserable attitude is generally not welcome here.
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Old Fri, Dec-02-2016, 12:57:43 PM   #42
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

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Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
They are made by clevite, which made the original bearing. The clearance is increased by a few 1000s of an inch, closer to industry standards for the journal size.


Good to know, thanks!
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Old Fri, Dec-02-2016, 04:36:17 PM   #43
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

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Originally Posted by Rez View Post
What are the BE bearings you speak of? How do you guys have confidence in some aftermarket part in the middle of you engine?
There is an extremely long thread on another forum where this was discussed to death and beyond.
I think it's clear these engines have an issue with their rob bearings. Practically 100% of the ones that have been preventatively removed look bad

The people who designed the BE bearings know what they're doing, they include people like PencilGeek and AutoTalent.

I'm definitely confident in these people building a quality part
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Old Sun, Dec-04-2016, 05:44:12 PM   #44
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

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Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
They are made by clevite, which made the original bearing. The clearance is increased by a few 1000s of an inch, closer to industry standards for the journal size.
Interesting, going to look into this option!
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Old Mon, Jan-02-2017, 02:00:53 PM   #45
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

Has anyone ever removed and inspected their BE bearings to see how they look after a few 10k miles? Be interesting to see if they show less wear than the stock bearings.
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Old Mon, Jan-02-2017, 04:02:58 PM   #46
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

^^Very good and key question.
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Old Mon, Jan-02-2017, 06:32:59 PM   #47
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

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Originally Posted by Rez View Post
^^Very good and key question.
That will be done after one year of driving in the test vehicle. See the oil flow analysis thread on this site for details of ongoing testing.
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=564264

I think a much better question is one that nobody is asking. Why are so many people removing and "inspecting" their VAC bearings? I certainly wouldn't recommend opening up a bottom end of a car "just because I'm curious" to see what the bearings look like. So why are so many people doing it with their VAC bearings? And then what are they doing: are they replacing the bearings again like they should once the bottom end is opened up, or are they just closing it back up again with the same bearings?

Once people replace their bearings with BE Bearings, I would expect that to be the end of it. Unless there's a reason to open up the bottom end again, I don't recommend doing it. So I'm not holding my breath to see people pulling their BE Bearings like they do with their VAC bearings.
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Old Mon, Jan-02-2017, 07:10:10 PM   #48
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rez View Post
What are the BE bearings you speak of? How do you guys have confidence in some aftermarket part in the middle of you engine?
Quote:
Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
They are made by clevite, which made the original bearing. The clearance is increased by a few 1000s of an inch, closer to industry standards for the journal size.
Yes, thanks. We spec'd the bearings, but Clevite designed and manufactured them. The original BMW bearings don't really meet industry standards for clearance per journal-inch diameter. This is generally believed why almost universally all bearings removed appear with excessive wear. The early engine failures also can generally be attributed to tolerance stack up. When you already have a design with too little clearance, then assemble an engine -- all pieces within specification, but on the outside edges of their design tolerances -- then you may end up with an engine that will fail very early in life.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
There is an extremely long thread on another forum where this was discussed to death and beyond.
I think it's clear these engines have an issue with their rob bearings. Practically 100% of the ones that have been preventatively removed look bad

The people who designed the BE bearings know what they're doing, they include people like PencilGeek and AutoTalent.

I'm definitely confident in these people building a quality part
Thanks! We take pride in the amount of design and testing we're doing. We know nobody else is doing what we do. There's a few more people behind the scenes that I can't really mention. They are industry leaders in these areas. We have great faith in the product, and it's not really a gamble like some people think.
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Old Mon, Jan-02-2017, 07:42:22 PM   #49
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
That will be done after one year of driving in the test vehicle. See the oil flow analysis thread on this site for details of ongoing testing.
http://www.m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=564264

I think a much better question is one that nobody is asking. Why are so many people removing and "inspecting" their VAC bearings? I certainly wouldn't recommend opening up a bottom end of a car "just because I'm curious" to see what the bearings look like. So why are so many people doing it with their VAC bearings? And then what are they doing: are they replacing the bearings again like they should once the bottom end is opened up, or are they just closing it back up again with the same bearings?

Once people replace their bearings with BE Bearings, I would expect that to be the end of it. Unless there's a reason to open up the bottom end again, I don't recommend doing it. So I'm not holding my breath to see people pulling their BE Bearings like they do with their VAC bearings.
Assuming that majority of cars with original BMW bearing won't fail, almost all the bearings removed looked "bad". The question was asked because the original bearings are largely being judged by their appearance, excessive wear. It is not clear if any of the bearings that were replaced were distant to fail, it is mainly an assumption.
It is nice to look at the graphs and analysis that you provided but the ultimate proof is cars with BE bearings showing statistically less failure than original ones. I am also curious to see how they look compared with original ones after similar mileage of driving.

Last edited by Rez; Mon, Jan-02-2017 at 07:51:38 PM.
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Old Mon, Jan-02-2017, 07:44:31 PM   #50
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Default Re: New m3 and rod bearings

Quote:
Originally Posted by PencilGeek View Post
Yes, thanks. We spec'd the bearings, but Clevite designed and manufactured them. The original BMW bearings don't really meet industry standards for clearance per journal-inch diameter. This is generally believed why almost universally all bearings removed appear with excessive wear. The early engine failures also can generally be attributed to tolerance stack up. When you already have a design with too little clearance, then assemble an engine -- all pieces within specification, but on the outside edges of their design tolerances -- then you may end up with an engine that will fail very early in life.



Thanks! We take pride in the amount of design and testing we're doing. We know nobody else is doing what we do. There's a few more people behind the scenes that I can't really mention. They are industry leaders in these areas. We have great faith in the product, and it's not really a gamble like some people think.
Why would you think BMW did not do what you have done with all their resources and reputation on the line? Why would they spec the bearings so tight for it to fail on their super expensive engines?
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Discussing New m3 and rod bearings in the E90 M3 (Sedan) | E92 M3 (Coupe) | E93 M3 (Convertible) (2008-2013) Forum - {Engine: S65 - Max Hp: 414 hp (420 hp Euro) at 8,300 rpm / 295 lb/ft at 3,900 rpm} at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)