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E46 M3 (2001-2006) Engine: S54 - Max Hp: 333 hp at 7,900 rpm / 262 lb/ft at 4,900 rpm
Total Produced: 45,000+ - Years Produced: 2001 to 2006.


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Old Fri, Dec-16-2011, 09:59:23 PM   #31
opey
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpower22 View Post
Try again...



not so much...

For those with limited knowledge of the E46 M3:

OE Muffler: 60lbs
CSL Muffler: 55lbs
HPF Muffler: 6 lbs (one of many lightweight aftermarket if you're looking for weight savings).
Source: http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/part...Titanium/13483
... and I have a CSL muffler weighed/installed
I would call that 50lbs+ actually.

OE Battery: 49lbs
CSL Battery: 34lbs
Braille Racing Battery: 21lbs
Hi/Low difference ~ 30lbs
Source: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=233195

Please don't post useless information that may be misleading to others when viewing this thread unless you have facts to back it up. Thanks!
once again... not so much. you are taking it to the EXTREME. plus the stock muffler is 52lbs as stated in your link, (not 60lbs wherever u got that, ive always heard 55lbs), PLUS that link is not even for a muffler, its just titanium pipes. the average aftermarket M3 muffler is around 25-30lbs, about half the weight of a stock muffler, not 6lbs. you could just take the muffler off and leave it like that if you're trying to get technical here. same with the battey. you COULD theoretically run a $300 5lb carbon fiber battery, not that it would work well. but the average, for a street driven car, is to go to the mini/csl size battery which is a 15lb drop as u stated. that thread u posted is from an e9x, not e46. and the user ended up having charging issues since its so small..

here is your facts: if you are going to put the lightest titanium pipe without a muffler, u can save 46lbs. otherwise, if its still a street driven car, you probably will save NOT more than 30 unless you go full titanium. same idea with the battery.
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Last edited by opey; Fri, Dec-16-2011 at 10:08:20 PM.
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Old Sat, Dec-17-2011, 01:33:59 AM   #32
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

I wish the german fellow with the Blue M3 in the youtube video, with the CSL intake posted more specifics on the exhaust. That car sounds absolutely ideal.
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Old Sat, Dec-17-2011, 02:21:58 AM   #33
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by mpower22 View Post
Try again...



not so much...

For those with limited knowledge of the E46 M3:

OE Muffler: 60lbs
CSL Muffler: 55lbs
HPF Muffler: 6 lbs (one of many lightweight aftermarket if you're looking for weight savings).
Source: http://www.horsepowerfreaks.com/part...Titanium/13483
... and I have a CSL muffler weighed/installed
I would call that 50lbs+ actually.

OE Battery: 49lbs
CSL Battery: 34lbs
Braille Racing Battery: 21lbs
Hi/Low difference ~ 30lbs
Source: http://www.m3post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=233195

actually your #s seem to be a bit off

from mikymu's thread where he converted his entire exhaust set up to oem csl:
http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=151391

Rear CSL muffler: 50 lbs.............................. US muffler: 55 lbs


i consider the hpf muffler is the biggest scam of all time. not only is it purely a straight pipe, it would probably lose power on a n/a car. it also sounds like pure crap.

in addition

oem battery = 45 lbs


csl battery = 34 lbs


all in all, it depends on what you want to do.

if you have a dd, i really don't see a point in dropping weight when its going to make the car no longer daily drivable friendly. (i.e. a titanium exhaust that drones and sounds like crap, removing the radio, removing the door panels, removing 1 windshield wiper, etc.etc.). if you get a muffler that is lighter than oem, but isn't obnoxious more power to you - but thats a hard one to find. but there are some out there.

i have said this from the beginning, if you want to shave 45lbs and not see evidence of it, do as follows:

1)remove front and rear seats
2)remove carpet
3)buy a heat gun
4)remove all the sound deadening in the car
5)reinstall carpet
6)reinstall seats

if you look at a stripped CSL, thats one of the things it doesn't have - sound deadening. thats 45lbs fast off the car. and those cars were not obnoxiously loud.

i had a csl battery - its not for me - i live in the NE and require the CCA of the oem battery.

you can also shed weight by removing the rear tool kid and the liner on the boot lid - believe it or not those tools add up for a few lbs.

the hardest thing is removing weight from the front of the car. also remember, after dropping 100lbs off the car, you should consider corner balancing the car.




regarding the OPs idea

i wouldn't waste time with the oem muffler. it is heavy and designed to flow properly. removing all the baffling can be done, but the amount you spend, you could pick up a used aftermarket muffler on the forum and be happy.
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Old Sat, Dec-17-2011, 02:56:35 AM   #34
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by IHatePosers View Post
actually your #s seem to be a bit off

from mikymu's thread where he converted his entire exhaust set up to oem csl:
http://m3forum.net/m3forum/showthread.php?t=151391

Rear CSL muffler: 50 lbs.............................. US muffler: 55 lbs


i consider the hpf muffler is the biggest scam of all time. not only is it purely a straight pipe, it would probably lose power on a n/a car. it also sounds like pure crap.

in addition

oem battery = 45 lbs


csl battery = 34 lbs


all in all, it depends on what you want to do.

if you have a dd, i really don't see a point in dropping weight when its going to make the car no longer daily drivable friendly. (i.e. a titanium exhaust that drones and sounds like crap, removing the radio, removing the door panels, removing 1 windshield wiper, etc.etc.). if you get a muffler that is lighter than oem, but isn't obnoxious more power to you - but thats a hard one to find. but there are some out there.

i have said this from the beginning, if you want to shave 45lbs and not see evidence of it, do as follows:

1)remove front and rear seats
2)remove carpet
3)buy a heat gun
4)remove all the sound deadening in the car
5)reinstall carpet
6)reinstall seats

if you look at a stripped CSL, thats one of the things it doesn't have - sound deadening. thats 45lbs fast off the car. and those cars were not obnoxiously loud.

i had a csl battery - its not for me - i live in the NE and require the CCA of the oem battery.

you can also shed weight by removing the rear tool kid and the liner on the boot lid - believe it or not those tools add up for a few lbs.

the hardest thing is removing weight from the front of the car. also remember, after dropping 100lbs off the car, you should consider corner balancing the car.




regarding the OPs idea

i wouldn't waste time with the oem muffler. it is heavy and designed to flow properly. removing all the baffling can be done, but the amount you spend, you could pick up a used aftermarket muffler on the forum and be happy.
I happen to have went the aftermarket route with a legit topspeed muffler from topspeed themselves. In addition Ive heard other mufflers including supersprint, rogue, and a few others for the E46 M3. Ive come accustomed to the unique acoustic that the stock muffler produces. My only motive is reproduce that sound but at a higher decibel level if at all possible. Headers is one route, but with that you need a tune and in addition section I cats. Ill continue with the project anyway for those interested, but thanks for the opinion.
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Old Sat, Dec-17-2011, 05:10:35 AM   #35
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by IHatePosers View Post
actually your #s seem to be a bit off
You're right. My numbers were 5 off after I thought about it. Thank you for clearing that up.

...OE battery is still ~49lbs - that one might be missing some fluid. I've seen weights as high in the 50's due to different variances perhaps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by opey View Post
once again... not so much. you are taking it to the EXTREME. plus the stock muffler is 52lbs as stated in your link, (not 60lbs wherever u got that, ive always heard 55lbs), PLUS that link is not even for a muffler, its just titanium pipes. the average aftermarket M3 muffler is around 25-30lbs, about half the weight of a stock muffler, not 6lbs. you could just take the muffler off and leave it like that if you're trying to get technical here. same with the battey. you COULD theoretically run a $300 5lb carbon fiber battery, not that it would work well. but the average, for a street driven car, is to go to the mini/csl size battery which is a 15lb drop as u stated. that thread u posted is from an e9x, not e46. and the user ended up having charging issues since its so small..

here is your facts: if you are going to put the lightest titanium pipe without a muffler, u can save 46lbs. otherwise, if its still a street driven car, you probably will save NOT more than 30 unless you go full titanium. same idea with the battery.
BTW - e92/e46 M3 - both take same part #; regardless of if the information came from from an e92 site.

Take a pound or give a few, we can go back and forth about different configs and run the post out. With what you're saying, even lowballing it - you're talking a 40lb difference at a minimum; not 30.

You are still detracting from the point however; which yet another member, IHatePosers stated clearly - corner balancing is needed if you're dropping weight. May not make much difference if you're a DD, unless you're pushing limits/corners from time to time such as I do. Either way, as stated in my original post and as stands: dropping weight in the rear only compromises the handling/dynamics of the car by disturbing the 50/50 weight distribution either way you look at it. The car was designed this way for a reason. End of discussion.
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Old Sun, Dec-18-2011, 04:18:33 AM   #36
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

For those that are interested, I started with the gutting of the muffler tonight. Initially the steel was a PITA to cut through, but with some pilot holes I was able to saw through the metal casing. The thickness of the steel shell is 1.50mm thick. Not sure what type of steel/metal it is, but its relatively strong and dent-proof. I separated the muffler into 3 sections for cutting (ill have pictures up soon), but the section furthermost to the passenger side/right side if facing muffler, was section 3 and the section I cut open first. I cut about a 10"x11" rectangular section out. Upon first cutting, I noticed many strands of fiberglass showing. When I removed the cut plate, the inside look liked BMW had stuffed a skunk in the chamber. It was packed tightly with fiberglass that had been charred I presume over the years and was black and white in color. I pulled it all out and noticed that the muffler is in fact separated into chambers. The welds on top of the muffler from the outside indicate where the steel plate walls inside are that are used for structural support. The pipe going to the outermost muffler tip is perforated and the inside pipe next to it is closed shell piping. The inside smelled of burnt/hot plastic for those of you who have ever smelled it. I will be tackling sections 1 & 2 tomorrow and then back here with pictures of my findings. I made a step-by-step outline discussing how and where to to cut open the muffler.
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Old Sun, Dec-18-2011, 12:13:07 PM   #37
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerfan08 View Post
For those that are interested, I started with the gutting of the muffler tonight. Initially the steel was a PITA to cut through, but with some pilot holes I was able to saw through the metal casing. The thickness of the steel shell is 1.50mm thick. Not sure what type of steel/metal it is, but its relatively strong and dent-proof. I separated the muffler into 3 sections for cutting (ill have pictures up soon), but the section furthermost to the passenger side/right side if facing muffler, was section 3 and the section I cut open first. I cut about a 10"x11" rectangular section out. Upon first cutting, I noticed many strands of fiberglass showing. When I removed the cut plate, the inside look liked BMW had stuffed a skunk in the chamber. It was packed tightly with fiberglass that had been charred I presume over the years and was black and white in color. I pulled it all out and noticed that the muffler is in fact separated into chambers. The welds on top of the muffler from the outside indicate where the steel plate walls inside are that are used for structural support. The pipe going to the outermost muffler tip is perforated and the inside pipe next to it is closed shell piping. The inside smelled of burnt/hot plastic for those of you who have ever smelled it. I will be tackling sections 1 & 2 tomorrow and then back here with pictures of my findings. I made a step-by-step outline discussing how and where to to cut open the muffler.
Great stuff!! Definitely looking forward to the results and lots of pics/vids!
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Old Sun, Dec-18-2011, 01:52:38 PM   #38
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerfan08 View Post
For those that are interested, I started with the gutting of the muffler tonight. Initially the steel was a PITA to cut through, but with some pilot holes I was able to saw through the metal casing. The thickness of the steel shell is 1.50mm thick. Not sure what type of steel/metal it is, but its relatively strong and dent-proof. I separated the muffler into 3 sections for cutting (ill have pictures up soon), but the section furthermost to the passenger side/right side if facing muffler, was section 3 and the section I cut open first. I cut about a 10"x11" rectangular section out. Upon first cutting, I noticed many strands of fiberglass showing. When I removed the cut plate, the inside look liked BMW had stuffed a skunk in the chamber. It was packed tightly with fiberglass that had been charred I presume over the years and was black and white in color. I pulled it all out and noticed that the muffler is in fact separated into chambers. The welds on top of the muffler from the outside indicate where the steel plate walls inside are that are used for structural support. The pipe going to the outermost muffler tip is perforated and the inside pipe next to it is closed shell piping. The inside smelled of burnt/hot plastic for those of you who have ever smelled it. I will be tackling sections 1 & 2 tomorrow and then back here with pictures of my findings. I made a step-by-step outline discussing how and where to to cut open the muffler.
Looking forward to it...
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Old Sun, Dec-18-2011, 05:24:28 PM   #39
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

in for updates.
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Old Sun, Dec-18-2011, 05:38:03 PM   #40
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Default Re: Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread

Since I just installed the M3an One headers and CRT200 along with my Gruppe M, we can test to see if the rasp deletes with 200 cell cats and headers will further deepen the sound or increase rasp.
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Discussing Gutting stock E46 M3 muffler discussion/compilation thread in the E46 M3 (2001-2006) Forum - Engine: S54 - Max Hp: 333 hp at 7,900 rpm / 262 lb/ft at 4,900 rpm
Total Produced: 45,000+ - Years Produced: 2001 to 2006. at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)