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M3 Track: Racing and DE Best mod for speed is learning to get the most out of what you currently have. Tracks and DE's is the place to start!


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Old Fri, May-03-2019, 03:10:14 AM   #41
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

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Did you get the race or the clubsport? I ended up ordering the clubsport because I wanted to retain AC
Initially, i got the clubsport because of the AC as well. Then i got "upgrade parts" to the race kit, which i cannot recommend.

The Clubsport is the way to go imo.

Yeah, i may need to fix the cooling hose after a while from rubbing, but i still have AC and don't mess up my wheels, pull the hose off the duct when i steer too far and don't have the swaybar impact the metal ducting because if clearance issues.

Just my experience though

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Old Fri, May-03-2019, 03:11:49 AM   #42
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

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Initially, i got the clubsport because of the AC as well. Then i got "upgrade parts" to the race kit, which i cannot recommend.

The Clubsport is the way to go imo.

Yeah, i may need to fix the cooling hose after a while from rubbing, but i still have AC and don't mess up my wheels, pull the hose off the duct when i steer too far and don't have the swaybar impact the metal ducting because if clearance issues.

Just my experience though

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No real way to get around rubbing? Is it the hose just rubbing against the wheel when you turn in?
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Old Fri, May-03-2019, 03:15:44 AM   #43
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

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No real way to get around rubbing? Is it the hose just rubbing against the wheel when you turn in?
Steering limiters would alleviate the rubbing issue. I think turner sells them as Rack Stops. Sadly no personal experience with it. May try it if changig hoses gets too annoying .

For a street car, a duct kit and limiters may make street use very annoying.

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Old Fri, May-03-2019, 03:17:56 AM   #44
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

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Steering limiters would alleviate the rubbing issue. I think turner sells them as Rack Stops. Sadly no personal experience with it. May try it if changig hoses gets too annoying .

For a street car, a duct kit and limiters may make street use very annoying.

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The limiters would be very annoying on a street car.

VIR (full course) shouldn’t really overheat brakes, in my experience. T1, T4, T11, T14 are the heavy braking areas but there’s so much time for them to cool off between.
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Old Fri, May-03-2019, 02:54:10 PM   #45
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

The limiters don't decrease turning radius that much, and you won't notice them unless you're doing a lot of 3-point turns.
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Old Wed, Jul-17-2019, 03:20:25 AM   #46
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

Busy few weeks (months, i guess...). Time to get caught back up!

On a whim, a few members and i decided to sign up for Hyperfest at VIR. None of us had ever been to an event like that, so we were curious what that is going to be like.
It definitely was an experience, to say the least... not sure if it's one that i'd like to repeat, though



Still running the very worn Nankangs (80+ heat cycles at that point), combined with the heat and a TON of traffic and incidents, made for a not super enjoyable event.


It was the first event where i was able to test out the new AP brakes, though. Confidence came quick and rear-end stability was VASTLY improved right away. Trailbraking is now actually an option
Temperature wise, i'll have to do some more testing. It was 96 degrees or so, but being VIR, i'm not as comfortable at the track as i am at Road Atlanta. Paired with the shorter sessions compared to Chin, i wanted to continue testing back home, where i have more experience.



Sadly, second to last session or so, my car threw a CEL, various codes (O2 related) and ran like poop. Not wanting to mess with hot headers in 90+ degrees, i decided to call it at that point. Come to find out, the pre-heater fuse had blown, a 30 Amp fuse! There were no cut cables or shorts. Replaced the fuse and everything is fine now. I'm suspecting it's related to the stock headers heating up the sensors, causing the short.



We were some of the last people to leave Hyperfest. Always eerie when just about everybody is gone.



The next day, i had to fly to Europe for work... definitely wouldn't recommend towing 6 hours from Virginia back home to get on a plane the next day xD.

Coming back from Europe, some fellow forum members AGAIN decided to do a last-minute VIR trip.



Since i didn't have enough time to figure out new tires, on went some old Continental slicks with unknown age and heat cycles. Guess still better than the Nankangs



This event was rather interesting. Monday event called Dave's Race, benefiting ALS research. An event like this was definitely new to me, with open track totaling a good 8 hours and featuring maybe 40 cars in total.



Being my first time on slicks, it was both interesting and intimidating. The grip levels were immediately superior to the Nankangs and i managed to improve my time by about 5 seconds over the last time during Hyperfest. Many factors came into play there for sure.



What became apparent throughout the day was that, after my quick first sessions, my times became slower and slower. The car felt less eager to turn, pushed out from the turns and generally became more loose. Guessing they were heat-cycled out at that point, but since VIR is a track i'm not too familiar with i decided it may just be my driving skills.
During one of the sessions, a bunch of E46 guys decided to try some formation driving and off-line practice. Naturally, i immediately screwed that up and had my first 4-off going into Turn 1


Lesson learned is all i can say. Way too slow in getting back on the gas after pinching the corner too hard, all on cold ass slicks on which i have no experience on.

Anyway!

After this one, the weekend after, i was back at Road Atlanta again with Chin. Pretty warm day, somewhere in the 90s again, but nothing too horrible. Decided to give the slicks another try. Needless to say i quickly learned that they are pretty much done done.


After this really weird slide going up Turn 1, i decided to just switch back to my street tires, my 340 Treadwear Continental ExtremeContact Sports. Figured they'll probably melt/overheat pretty bad, but anything was better than the slicks.

Interestingly enough, they held up fairly well during the longer 30 minute sessions, especially when doing cooldowns. Within 2-3 laps, i was able to shave 2 seconds off my time that i ran on the slicks. Goes to show how much confidence affects lap times.



By the end of the day, i actually managed a 1:46.311 on these, on the last lap, during happy hour, before we got black flagged due to a crash. So there is a good bit more in these tires, still. I'm pretty impressed and it's making me rethink spending tons of money on R-Comps or even slicks when i have yet to reach the absolute limit of these street tires...


The brakes definitely got a bigger work-out this time. There seems to be a slightly mushy feeling that i'll need to figure out, but the brakes held up fine, lap after lap, without fading, even during the 1 hour long happy hour session. Some heat-checking is appearing, but nothing major. The DS1.11 pads and RS29s are holding up EXTREMELY well. I'm maybe at 3/4 wear at this point, which is a welcome change compared to what happened previously...



Next up will be another Chin event at Road Atlanta in mid August. Before that, there are a few things to address. Fluid changes all around (transmission is notchy), checking out a slight power-steering weep as well as a rattle in the passenger rear side, just to make sure everything is up to snuff, since she hasn't had a proper check-up in a few months/4 events.



Thanks for looking!
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Old Wed, Jul-17-2019, 03:33:06 PM   #47
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

Mirrors my experience with those slicks; "Wow, these are great" transforms to "wait, where did my slicks go?" very unpredictably if you're running on unknown/ mis-matched heat cycles. Personally, I've just gone with new, <200tw tires and I've really enjoyed the consistent grip

I would replace the O2 sensors on that circuit - properly functioning sensors/ wiring should not blow a 30A fuse. My guess is that once you get in there, you'll find something either got chewed or melted to cause an intermittent short.

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Old Fri, Jul-19-2019, 05:07:53 PM   #48
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

Nice updates ! Wonder if your pedal feel (lack of) was tire related . Sry if I missed what tire were you on when you experienced . Slick or Conti ?


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Old Fri, Jul-19-2019, 11:06:29 PM   #49
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

I have had the same 30A fuse blow on me at the track. Luckily it was a rear O2 and we just disconnected it. The wire was melted onto the header.
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Old Mon, Jul-22-2019, 06:12:01 PM   #50
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Default Re: First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing"

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Originally Posted by Drewster View Post
Mirrors my experience with those slicks; "Wow, these are great" transforms to "wait, where did my slicks go?" very unpredictably if you're running on unknown/ mis-matched heat cycles. Personally, I've just gone with new, <200tw tires and I've really enjoyed the consistent grip
It really caught me off guard. Fellow E46 M3 guys running Pirellis said that they run them down to the Cords no problem. Naturally, not as fast as fresh, but not a 5-7 Second drop off in times with sketchy handling .
Definitely going to snag some 200 TW tires. Switching to the Street tires made me realize that there is potential in those that i can exploit still, so i feel that R-Comps would not be worth it since i'm not able to really get to their limits (That's my thinking at least).

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Originally Posted by Exclusivs View Post
Nice updates ! Wonder if your pedal feel (lack of) was tire related . Sry if I missed what tire were you on when you experienced . Slick or Conti ?
Thanks man!
The pedal feel started to deteriorate noticeably during the Road Atlanta event, where i was on slicks first, then switched to the Conti ExtremeContacts later on.
I've heard people say that with RBF600, they need to bleed the brakes prior to each event, which got me thinking that i may need to try SRF, with its higher wet boiling point may be the ticket.

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I would replace the O2 sensors on that circuit - properly functioning sensors/ wiring should not blow a 30A fuse. My guess is that once you get in there, you'll find something either got chewed or melted to cause an intermittent short.
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I have had the same 30A fuse blow on me at the track. Luckily it was a rear O2 and we just disconnected it. The wire was melted onto the header.
After Hyperfest and the fuse incident (Which i didn't know was just the fuse at the time), i thought the same thing, so i disassembled the exhaust side of the engine to chase down a cut wire. Both pre and post sensors i had changed a few months back, by the way.
To my surprise, none of them show signs of any wear on the sleeving. Tugging on them also revealed no obvious shorts, so i just put a new fuse in and started the car to test it. Fuse was fine, car ran great. Ran it at another VIR event and Road Atlanta after that and never managed to reproduce the issue.
Only thing i could think of is that the CATs were so hot coming off the track and not letting the car cool off enough, when i hopped back in and started it to go get gas, the heater circuit of the sensors so hot in that it acted like a short, spiking power and blowing the fuse. Still though, a 30 Amp fuse...
Dunno, just a theory.
Picked up some Euro Headers locally, thinking that the issue will persist, so i'll be looking at swapping those in sometime. Just need to figure out who can help me disabled the EGT and Post O2s and make it run right first. At that point, i may just change the Pre O2 sensors, just in case.
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Discussing First Track Car Build - "I'll just change this one thing" in the M3 Track: Racing and DE Forum - Best mod for speed is learning to get the most out of what you currently have. Tracks and DE's is the place to start! at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)