BMW M3 Forum
BMW M3 Forum BMW M3 Gallery BMW M3 Reviews BMW M3 Social Groups BMW M3 Chat M3Forum Sponsors >>
Loading


Mobile M3forum
Go Back   BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X) > BMW M3 Discussions > E46 M3 (2001-2006) > Coding and Tuning
Tire Rack Buy Winter Tires Now!
Not a member? Register Now!
Register Gallery All Albums Garage Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Calendar FAQ

Coding and Tuning Discuss all avenues of coding and tuning here!


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Mon, Jul-02-2018, 04:44:03 AM   #881
bimmerdriver
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,347
In the garage:
Reputation: 0 bimmerdriver is on a distinguished road
Location: Metro Vancouver

Canada




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Quote:
Originally Posted by geargrndr View Post
Two answers...

Ideally.... you always use some kind of a charger that:

1. has a 'programming' setting that puts the system voltage up in the 14-15 range and holds it there, and
2. supports enough current (amps) so that it can maintain that voltage level while regardless of might be activated/drawing during the flash period.

There's a whole debate about how BMW now specs some 100A charger and so people think it needs 100A of actual current to program but that's BS. Even granting that F-series do apparently suck a lot more power down, its not remotely the "70A" or whatever it is that BMW says someplace. I'm pretty sure that's a massive misinterpretation of a combination of CYA on their part, and, the fact that in order to spec a quality, reliable, dealer-abusable unit, it also happens to be a high amperage unit. Like if you want a really reliable pro-use generator, you could end up with way more wattage than you need cuz you can't get a low power one with the best quality.

But we're back here in the ancient times of E46's anyway, and things aren't nearly so problematic. To keep an 'ignition on but blower fan off and door closed' E46 at voltage, its generally in the single digit amps not 100's. Its really not a big requirement.

But... Practically/pragmatically... IME, a rock solid battery and no major consumers on in the car will manage a quick 'data only' flash fine, as long as your car has no issues (and the battery is truly fully charged / no issues). Honestly the bigger danger is that you kick the cable out with your foot or it falls out because it didn't quite seat perfectly.

In the real world:
- I have flashed my cars on a solid battery only plenny of times.
- If I'm working on somebody elses car I always put a charger on that can supply up to 25A, because - CMA too, and, I'd hate to have the one time freak-brick be on sombody elses' ride.
- Even on my cars, if I'm programming for any length of time - like more than one quick flash - I'll hook up something. But sometimes that well might be one of the couple little ~1A-ish tenders I have, just as 'light insurance'.
- If I'm flashing the program too, (not just data) then I'll prob hook up a bigger charger, because of the increased flashing/programming time and increased hassle if it bricks mid-flash

So... yes ideally best if you have a fat charger on it with a 'programming' mode, but, a known good/charged battery and tender should be fine.
I agree with much of what you say. The requirement for high current chargers is valid for newer BMWs (although, perhaps not 100A), but not for the E46. I have an HP laboratory power supply that I use as a battery charger / power supply while coding. When I set it to the float voltage (13.6V) with the key turned on, the car will draw around 10A. (That's with all accessories turned off, although my car has DRLs.) While you can probably get away without a charger if you have a new battery, depleting a battery reduces its life. It's better for the battery and safer if you use a charger. I suggest getting a good quality charger that puts out at least 10A.
__________________
2002 (12/2001) M3 6MT Coupe Carbon Black on Black - ZCP/CSL Wheels, 245/35/19 Mich PS2 & 285/30/19 Conti ExtremeContact DW, H&R 15 mm Front Spacers, CSL F/R Brakes, EBC Redstuff, TMS SS F/R Brake Lines, PSS9, TMS F/R Sway Bars, TMS Rear Control Arms, TMS Underdrive Pulleys, TMS/Carbonio Intake, Eisenmann Exhaust, AutoSolutions 30% SSK, BMW Illuminated Shift Knob, BMW Performance Pedals, BMW Performance 4.10 R&P, CDV Delete, Flossmann GTR Carbon Fiber Hood/Trunk, Carbon Fiber Rear Diffuser, Euro Front Signal Lights, Euro Rear Tail Lights, Angel Eyes, Homelink

1997 328is 5MT Coupe Madeira Violet on Black - Staggered M Forged Double Spoke Wheels, Bilstein Sport, H&R Sport, M Tech Rear Spoiler (Sold)
Jump to top bimmerdriver is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Register now and remove these ads
Old Mon, Jul-02-2018, 04:54:03 AM   #882
terraphantm
Moderator
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 11,808
In the garage:
Reputation: 11 terraphantm is on a distinguished road
Location: Philadelphia

United States




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerdriver View Post
I agree with much of what you say. The requirement for high current chargers is valid for newer BMWs (although, perhaps not 100A), but not for the E46. I have an HP laboratory power supply that I use as a battery charger / power supply while coding. When I set it to the float voltage (13.6V) with the key turned on, the car will draw around 10A. (That's with all accessories turned off, although my car has DRLs.) While you can probably get away without a charger if you have a new battery, depleting a battery reduces its life. It's better for the battery and safer if you use a charger. I suggest getting a good quality charger that puts out at least 10A.
Vast majority of us are not running DRLs, in which case the power draw is much less than 10A.

And really... a flash takes what, 3 minutes with BMW flash and 30 seconds with MSSFlasher? You're not going to damage a battery even if the load is 50A in that time frame.
__________________
Jump to top terraphantm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mon, Jul-02-2018, 05:11:22 AM   #883
Dr M3an M3
GroupBuyingPower@outlook. com
 
Dr M3an M3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 2,805
In the garage:
Reputation: 0 Dr M3an M3 is on a distinguished road
Location: Columbia, SC

United States




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Quote:
Originally Posted by terraphantm View Post
Vast majority of us are not running DRLs, in which case the power draw is much less than 10A.

And really... a flash takes what, 3 minutes with BMW flash and 30 seconds with MSSFlasher? You're not going to damage a battery even if the load is 50A in that time frame.
I swear, sometimes MSSFlasher takes less than 10seconds. A few times it has flashed so fast I was skeptic anything happened until I tested it afterwards. Lovely program.
__________________
2004 E46 ///M3 - Oxford Green Metallic II + Cinnamon SMG
IG: DrM3anM3

Mods: Karbonius CSL Airbox, OE CSL Snorkel w/ working Flap, OE Map Sensor + OE Air Rail, Paul Claude Custom Tune, CSL Engine management with CSL converted DME, Supersprint V1 Stepped Headers w/ Oversized Catless section 1, SS 2.5" Twin-Piped Oversized section 2, Supersprint LW Race Muffler, WPC treated rod-bearings, VinceBar (weld) + Redish Plates, Full Beisan VANOS lockdown, BBS LMs w/ PSS, Streamline CSL Bumper, CSL style CF diffuser, Vorsteiner CF CSL Bootlid, CSL SMG Engine DME tune, CSL '255' SMG DME tune, .
Active Group-Buys (PM if Interested): OE CSL Bootlids, CSL Bumper, OE CSL Wheels, Supersprint Headers/Exhaust MEGA thread, CSL Airbox, Brembo, Cams/Pistons...and more to come!
Please PM me - In search of: Dixis Spirit Titanium muffler -- have until end of august to find one, before I go custom.

Last edited by Dr M3an M3; Mon, Jul-02-2018 at 05:16:15 AM.
Jump to top Dr M3an M3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mon, Jul-02-2018, 04:10:43 PM   #884
geargrndr
Working for Nefarious Porpoises
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 784
Reputation: 0 geargrndr is on a distinguished road
Location: AndoverRockport MA & Intl

United States




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Quote:
Originally Posted by terraphantm View Post
Vast majority of us are not running DRLs, in which case the power draw is much less than 10A.
Seems to me we've had this same argument w/ bimmerdriver before... the HP PS discussion seems familiar...

Although if you DO have DRL's then the extra-current capability is legit... although as menched, w/ MSSFlasher these days it hardly takes any electrons at all to get the job done..

FWIW Bimmerdriver, if you're going to the trouble to hook it up, you should for sure turn that HP (gotta love old HP lab gear... I'd love to have the supply you're talking about I"m sure) up to something in the 14-14.5 range, which is standard 'programming voltage', and what the auto specific programming chargers will provide. Not that 13.6V isn't 100% fine for this purpose, esp backed by all that amperage capacity so you're sure it can't sag. Just sayin', if you're going to the trouble you might as well set it to the recommended levels...
__________________
2003 M3CicM6 TiAg
2002 540iT Sport Vortech S/C 6MT LSD TiAg
2008 Audi A3 2.0T DSG (hers)
1999 Cherokee Sport 4L (trailer-hitched in-law loaner bomber)

Recently Former...
1995.5 Audi S6 Avant (utility/winter billetturbobattlewagen)


Jump to top geargrndr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Jul-03-2018, 04:37:00 AM   #885
bimmerdriver
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 3,347
In the garage:
Reputation: 0 bimmerdriver is on a distinguished road
Location: Metro Vancouver

Canada




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Quote:
Originally Posted by geargrndr View Post
Seems to me we've had this same argument w/ bimmerdriver before... the HP PS discussion seems familiar...

Although if you DO have DRL's then the extra-current capability is legit... although as menched, w/ MSSFlasher these days it hardly takes any electrons at all to get the job done..

FWIW Bimmerdriver, if you're going to the trouble to hook it up, you should for sure turn that HP (gotta love old HP lab gear... I'd love to have the supply you're talking about I"m sure) up to something in the 14-14.5 range, which is standard 'programming voltage', and what the auto specific programming chargers will provide. Not that 13.6V isn't 100% fine for this purpose, esp backed by all that amperage capacity so you're sure it can't sag. Just sayin', if you're going to the trouble you might as well set it to the recommended levels...
You can find the HP power supplies on ebay. If you watch long enough, you will find one. 12.6 volts is the open-circuit voltage for a lead-acid battery. That's the lowest voltage a lead acid battery should be held to. 13.6 volts is the float voltage. 14.4 is the charge voltage. If the battery needs to be charged, then sure, use the charge voltage, but if it's already charged, 13.6 is much better for it. Leaving a battery at the charge voltage when it doesn't need to be charged is not good for it. If you don't know what the difference between float voltage and charge voltage, then google is your friend.
__________________
2002 (12/2001) M3 6MT Coupe Carbon Black on Black - ZCP/CSL Wheels, 245/35/19 Mich PS2 & 285/30/19 Conti ExtremeContact DW, H&R 15 mm Front Spacers, CSL F/R Brakes, EBC Redstuff, TMS SS F/R Brake Lines, PSS9, TMS F/R Sway Bars, TMS Rear Control Arms, TMS Underdrive Pulleys, TMS/Carbonio Intake, Eisenmann Exhaust, AutoSolutions 30% SSK, BMW Illuminated Shift Knob, BMW Performance Pedals, BMW Performance 4.10 R&P, CDV Delete, Flossmann GTR Carbon Fiber Hood/Trunk, Carbon Fiber Rear Diffuser, Euro Front Signal Lights, Euro Rear Tail Lights, Angel Eyes, Homelink

1997 328is 5MT Coupe Madeira Violet on Black - Staggered M Forged Double Spoke Wheels, Bilstein Sport, H&R Sport, M Tech Rear Spoiler (Sold)
Jump to top bimmerdriver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Jul-03-2018, 12:54:51 PM   #886
geargrndr
Working for Nefarious Porpoises
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 784
Reputation: 0 geargrndr is on a distinguished road
Location: AndoverRockport MA & Intl

United States




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

OK now we're back to this lecturey thing. Dude we know about float and charge voltage. We are not talking about that.

I'd thought about putting the note out there that obv its not good to do that for long periods but I figured it was unnecessary.

We are talking about setting it at a PROGRAMMING voltage, which you apply for a limited period. Nobody is saying float your battery at 14.5V all winter while its in storage under the car cover.

But the OE specs are to put it at something 14-14.5V just while programming. Your battery will be 100000% fine and 10000% unaffected by that.
__________________
2003 M3CicM6 TiAg
2002 540iT Sport Vortech S/C 6MT LSD TiAg
2008 Audi A3 2.0T DSG (hers)
1999 Cherokee Sport 4L (trailer-hitched in-law loaner bomber)

Recently Former...
1995.5 Audi S6 Avant (utility/winter billetturbobattlewagen)


Jump to top geargrndr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Wed, Jul-11-2018, 12:04:34 AM   #887
Toxic0n
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 233
Reputation: 0 Toxic0n is on a distinguished road
Location: Vancouver

Canada




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Hi guys,
I'm having an issue disabling burble/pop. I have enabled Stage 1 and want to completely turn it off.
When I load my .bin, I get a popup saying "Please accept our terms of service". When I click OK, the Burble/Pop checkbox becomes checked and greyed out.
Accepting the terms of service on the "Backfire" tab does not do anything.

Edit: Went back to my stock .bin and made my changes from there, looks like a bug in the program.
__________________

Ground Control, Mason Engineering, HRE, ACS, Rogue Engineering

Last edited by Toxic0n; Wed, Jul-11-2018 at 03:45:03 AM.
Jump to top Toxic0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Thu, Jul-12-2018, 07:46:30 AM   #888
MartynT
Registered User
 
MartynT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 570
In the garage:
Reputation: 0 MartynT is on a distinguished road

United Kingdom




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Quote:
Originally Posted by Toxic0n View Post
Hi guys,
I'm having an issue disabling burble/pop. I have enabled Stage 1 and want to completely turn it off.
When I load my .bin, I get a popup saying "Please accept our terms of service". When I click OK, the Burble/Pop checkbox becomes checked and greyed out.
Accepting the terms of service on the "Backfire" tab does not do anything.

Edit: Went back to my stock .bin and made my changes from there, looks like a bug in the program.
Yup, that's a bug unfortunately. I'll take a look at some point.
Jump to top MartynT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Wed, Aug-01-2018, 07:28:22 PM   #889
aryan_m3
Instagram @E46_Nation
 
aryan_m3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 628
In the garage:
Reputation: 0 aryan_m3 is on a distinguished road
Location: SoCal

Armenia




Default Re: MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool

Hey Martyn, I private messaged you, having a problem with my licensing, emailed you also please let me know how we can resolve it!
__________________



2002 BMW Sparkling Graphite Metallic E46 ///M3 6MT

Instagram : @Aryan_M3
Jump to top aryan_m3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 11:27:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
M3Forum.com and M3forum.net is in no way sponsored, endorsed or affiliated by or with BMW NA / BMW AG or any of it's subsidiaries or vendors.
BMW and M3 (E90 M3 | E92 M3 | E93 M3 | E46 M3 | E36 M3 | E30 M3) are registered trademarks of BMW AG.
M3Forum Terms of Service
Copyright 1999-2017 M3Forum.com
Discussing MSS52 / MSS54 / MSS54HP Binary Modification Tool in the Coding and Tuning Forum - Discuss all avenues of coding and tuning here! at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)