BMW M3 Forum
BMW M3 Forum BMW M3 Gallery BMW M3 Reviews BMW M3 Social Groups BMW M3 Chat M3Forum Sponsors >>
Loading


Mobile M3forum
Go Back   BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X) > M3Forum Garage > M3 Track: Racing and DE
Tire Rack Buy Winter Tires Now!
Not a member? Register Now!
Register Gallery All Albums Garage Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Calendar FAQ

M3 Track: Racing and DE Best mod for speed is learning to get the most out of what you currently have. Tracks and DE's is the place to start!


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old Sat, Apr-08-2017, 09:28:47 PM   #61
SG/IRM3
Flyguy
 
SG/IRM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 476
Reputation: 0 SG/IRM3 is on a distinguished road
Location: O'Fallon,IL

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

^ Thanks. That tracks with what Vorshlag said,that some people experience the noise and others don't and that sometimes the noise disappears. Makes me wonder if spring rate or possibly rebound setting has some effect on it. It didn't seem as noticeable when I first drove the car after the install with MCS recommended settings of 4/8 (compression rebound) front and rear. I've been playing with street settings and am at 4/6 in the rear now and will bump things up a bit to see if it has any effect.
__________________
Mike K.
2005 M3
Jump to top SG/IRM3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Register now and remove these ads
Old Sun, Apr-09-2017, 05:46:55 PM   #62
SG/IRM3
Flyguy
 
SG/IRM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 476
Reputation: 0 SG/IRM3 is on a distinguished road
Location: O'Fallon,IL

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

Just to follow up a little,I played with rebound settings in the rear this morning and found that going from 6 clicks to 8 clicks in the rear reduced the noise significantly and only the sharpest expansion joints or dips resulted in the noise. Going to 9 clicks virtually eliminated it but is a tad stiff for the street and affects ride noticeably but still very tolerable. It's amazing how much one click in either compression or rebound produces such a noticeable change.
__________________
Mike K.
2005 M3
Jump to top SG/IRM3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 05:40:19 PM   #63
Bimmerman325i
Beardface McMountainMan
 
Bimmerman325i's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,141
Reputation: 0 Bimmerman325i is on a distinguished road
Location: Menlo Park

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

Quote:
Originally Posted by SG/IRM3 View Post
~MCS rattling description~
Yup, mine made/make that noise. I was under the impression only the early sets made the noise, and that they had a fix for it? I pre-ordered them in 2013 so mine are one of the very earliest 2WNR sets.

I sent mine in last summer to have the noise corrected and they've been better since (still not silent). I know I wasn't charged for the fix, but can't remember if I paid for shipping (probably did). I went through Bimmerworld for the repair, which was painless.

One thing I've been wondering is whether the spherical bearing at the base of the rear shocks has play in it, and that part of the rattle is from that. Everything seems tight and with zero play on the lift, but on the road it's evident something is moving around and making noise.
__________________
1995 BMW M3/2/5-- S54/Mk60 California Smog Legal (Build Thread)
1998 BMW M3/4/5 -- DD rev1
2017 Chevrolet SS, 6MT, Orange Blast Metallic -- DD rev2
Jump to top Bimmerman325i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 06:04:09 PM   #64
aaronpoweruser
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 135
Reputation: 0 aaronpoweruser is on a distinguished road
Location: Atlanta

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

Quote:
Originally Posted by SG/IRM3 View Post
I recently installed MCS 2WNR suspension on my E46 M3,replacing the AST 4100s I ran for several years. I kept my Vorshlag camber plates (had them rebuilt by Vorshlag) and 550f/650r Hyperco springs. After one autocross test and tune and a couple hundred street miles I have to agree they offer excellent control and a very large range of adjustment. I won't get to track them for another month but very much looking forward to it and getting more familiar with them.

I do have one issue that I had not seen in the extensive research I did before buying them. At low speeds over abrupt road changes like expansion joints there is a knocking/rattling in the rear shocks. Both Jason McDaniel at Vorshlag and Kent McCray at MCS confirm this is a known issue for some people and is a result of the valving mechanism in relationship to the piston. MCS says they are working on a fix but none available yet and will fix them for no charge when they have a fix. The noise is virtually non-existent at highway speeds or relatively smooth roads without expansion joints. Has anyone else experienced this or something similar? I'm using Vorshlag spherical rear shock mounts (top nut is tight) which may amplify the noise somewhat and am considering swapping in the Rogue RSMs I used previously to see if that reduces the noise any. Can anyone provide any feedback or experience with this?
Are they worth the upgrade, im on ast4200s running the same spring rates. Is the ride quality better on the street?
Jump to top aaronpoweruser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 06:13:40 PM   #65
CrookedCommie
Captain Slow
 
CrookedCommie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 824
In the garage:
Reputation: 0 CrookedCommie is on a distinguished road
Location: Cincinnati

Bulgaria




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

Quote:
Originally Posted by SG/IRM3 View Post
I do have one issue that I had not seen in the extensive research I did before buying them. At low speeds over abrupt road changes like expansion joints there is a knocking/rattling in the rear shocks. Both Jason McDaniel at Vorshlag and Kent McCray at MCS confirm this is a known issue for some people and is a result of the valving mechanism in relationship to the piston. MCS says they are working on a fix but none available yet and will fix them for no charge when they have a fix. The noise is virtually non-existent at highway speeds or relatively smooth roads without expansion joints. Has anyone else experienced this or something similar? I'm using Vorshlag spherical rear shock mounts (top nut is tight) which may amplify the noise somewhat and am considering swapping in the Rogue RSMs I used previously to see if that reduces the noise any. Can anyone provide any feedback or experience with this?
I switched my rear TCK D/A from the rogue poly RSM to the spherical, same thing. I can hear every expansion joint and pot hole as a clunk, when I installed them I thought something was loose.
Jump to top CrookedCommie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 06:15:04 PM   #66
SG/IRM3
Flyguy
 
SG/IRM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 476
Reputation: 0 SG/IRM3 is on a distinguished road
Location: O'Fallon,IL

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

^ Evidently we're not alone,Vorshlag said they have several customers with the issue although not everyone. I,too,wondered about the spherical bearing at the bottom of the shock but mine seems tight as well. I was a little surprised that increasing the rebound helped lessen the noise and decided to try it after 10speed posted above that in his case the noise went away after going to a stiffer rear spring. Still very happy with the suspension and look forward to some track days next month.

I have to agree with your comments in another thread where you describe this as a streetable track suspension. Very accurate description.

Edit: directed at bimmerman325i
__________________
Mike K.
2005 M3

Last edited by SG/IRM3; Tue, Apr-11-2017 at 06:39:18 PM. Reason: clarification
Jump to top SG/IRM3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 06:34:15 PM   #67
SG/IRM3
Flyguy
 
SG/IRM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 476
Reputation: 0 SG/IRM3 is on a distinguished road
Location: O'Fallon,IL

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

Quote:
Originally Posted by aaronpoweruser View Post
Are they worth the upgrade, im on ast4200s running the same spring rates. Is the ride quality better on the street?
I'm coming from AST 4100s with the dampers and RSMs being the only change. IMO it's worth the upgrade because the handling has gone to another level even at MCS's recommended settings. I haven't tracked it yet but using some local back roads that give a suspension a real workout the MCS suspension is in another league. The chassis is so well controlled and responsive it feels like a different car. I expected an incremental increase but was surprised at the improvement. Again,this is at baseline settings so I'm sure the potential is even greater.

I would say ride quality is definitely improved over my ASTs because of the greater control but these are firm (not harsh) for sure. The range of adjustment is huge and I'm still experimenting with street settings. As expected,the softest settings are very smooth over relatively smooth surfaces but result in the car being underdamped over even medium bumps and dips. I didn't like the softest settings for that reason. I think with the available adjustment range it's possible to accommodate a variety of spring rates to achieve a ride that would suit most.
__________________
Mike K.
2005 M3
Jump to top SG/IRM3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 06:38:09 PM   #68
SG/IRM3
Flyguy
 
SG/IRM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 476
Reputation: 0 SG/IRM3 is on a distinguished road
Location: O'Fallon,IL

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrookedCommie View Post
I switched my rear TCK D/A from the rogue poly RSM to the spherical, same thing. I can hear every expansion joint and pot hole as a clunk, when I installed them I thought something was loose.
I think the spherical RSMs play a huge role in transmitting the noise as well. Add the spherical bearing at the shock bottom and probably a double whammy. I have my Rogues just in case.
__________________
Mike K.
2005 M3
Jump to top SG/IRM3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Tue, Apr-11-2017, 06:40:49 PM   #69
Bimmerman325i
Beardface McMountainMan
 
Bimmerman325i's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 1,141
Reputation: 0 Bimmerman325i is on a distinguished road
Location: Menlo Park

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

I took out the spherical RSMs (GCs) and went to the bushing GCs. It helped, but there is still lots of noise.

I'm actually in process of softening up the car. Pulling out all the poly and spherical bearings for OEM rubber. The NVH (really, just the clunking) is more than I'm willing to tolerate nowadays. I'm hoping that changing all but the MCSs will make it tolerable again on the drive to the track (no interior, so....clunks amplify).
__________________
1995 BMW M3/2/5-- S54/Mk60 California Smog Legal (Build Thread)
1998 BMW M3/4/5 -- DD rev1
2017 Chevrolet SS, 6MT, Orange Blast Metallic -- DD rev2
Jump to top Bimmerman325i is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Thu, Oct-12-2017, 08:16:45 PM   #70
SG/IRM3
Flyguy
 
SG/IRM3's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 476
Reputation: 0 SG/IRM3 is on a distinguished road
Location: O'Fallon,IL

United States




Default Re: Looking for feedback on MCS suspension

I now have nine track days,several autocross events and about 1500 street miles on the MCS 2WNR suspension and though I'd update my impressions so far. I'm running 550f/650r springs with Vorshlag camber plates and a 30mm H&R front sway bar/stock rear bar. For further reference I previously ran AST 4100s for seven years with the same components. Overall,I'm extremely happy with my decision to buy this suspension with my only regret being not doing it sooner. And,after being a little apprehensive about going to a double adjustable suspension,I'm very glad I did. Having the ability to adjust compression settings has been a huge benefit. For the first time I've been able to make the rear end of the car work as well as the front and put power down on corner exit better than ever.

On the street it is pretty easy to tune the ride due to the wide range of adjustments available,especially when every click is immediately noticeable. Despite their reputation for how well they ride this is a track suspension and while the ride is not harsh it is definitely firm even on the softer settings. I found the softest settings to be underdamped and currently run bump/rebound at 3/6 front and 4/6 rear FWIW. It's a little firm but very controlled. If the smoothest ride possible is a priority I'm not sure these should be your first choice. If you want an amazing performance suspension for track and/or autocross MCS should absolutely be at or near the top of your list.

For track use,I'm not sure there are enough superlatives to describe them. The car is so well controlled it kind of defies description but it feels so planted it increases your confidence significantly which in itself leads to faster lap times. And bumps do not upset the car at all. It has been a big improvement over my ASTs which are a pretty solid suspension but this is a major step up. I'm sure I haven't realized the suspension's full potential but even at this point it's been worth the cost of entry.

In summary,I would say the suspension is everything it is claimed to be and has exceeded my expectations for the most part. I'll probably move to stiffer springs during the off season to take fuller advantage of the capability these offer and do so being confident the car will still be relatively comfortable on the street. Just an outstanding suspension.
__________________
Mike K.
2005 M3
Jump to top SG/IRM3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT. The time now is 09:31:45 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
M3Forum.com and M3forum.net is in no way sponsored, endorsed or affiliated by or with BMW NA / BMW AG or any of it's subsidiaries or vendors.
BMW and M3 (E90 M3 | E92 M3 | E93 M3 | E46 M3 | E36 M3 | E30 M3) are registered trademarks of BMW AG.
M3Forum Terms of Service
Copyright 1999-2017 M3Forum.com
Discussing Looking for feedback on MCS suspension in the M3 Track: Racing and DE Forum - Best mod for speed is learning to get the most out of what you currently have. Tracks and DE's is the place to start! at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)