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E36 M3 (1992-1999) {Euro - S50 B32 321hp @ 7400 rpm} {U.S. - S52 B32 240 hp @ 6000 rpm}
Total Produced: 71,212 - Years Produced: 1992 to 1999


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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 02:19:36 AM   #21
pbonsalb
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

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Originally Posted by kingchris View Post

The major benefit of a pulley kit is that it replaces that plastic water pump pulley with a metal one.
I use an aftermarket aluminum stock dimension water pump pulley . . . and a Stewart pump. I think my E90M3 has a plastic water pump pulley and it redlines at 8400.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 02:43:11 AM   #22
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

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Originally Posted by pbonsalb View Post
I use an aftermarket aluminum stock dimension water pump pulley . . . and a Stewart pump. I think my E90M3 has a plastic water pump pulley and it redlines at 8400.
A few years ago my wife's e36 plastic water pump pulley broke. It happened to be on a Saturday which the only place that had one available was the stealer. It cost close to $80 for that part. So the moral of the story is that with an aluminum pulley, this type of incident would have never occurred. When plastic is new it is strong and light, but give it 100,000 miles of heat and cool cycles and it will become a failure part. So if you are going to replace it, it makes sense to do the upgrade and gain a few horses as well as piece of mind.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 02:53:44 AM   #23
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

I got one for $24 from my local dealer. Sounds like yours was gouging to me. Plastic is generally FTL in these types of components, gotta agree with you on that one. But to run out and drop $250+ on a set of UD pulleys for an upgraded WP pulley, not so much. Like pbonsalb said you could get a standard sized aluminum one if all you wanted was peace of mind. This is not the Bang for the Buck mod everyone seems to think it is; though it will make a difference it is minimal. I could think of quite a list of things I would be better off spending the money on. The one mentioned by tbaker474 would be at the top of the list.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 03:43:01 PM   #24
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

im on the fence about doing pulleys. I have a drop in filter/elbow, tune, and an exhaust, would these be enough supporting mods for the pullies to make a difference?
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 05:38:23 PM   #25
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

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Originally Posted by dvacc20 View Post
im on the fence about doing pulleys. I have a drop in filter/elbow, tune, and an exhaust, would these be enough supporting mods for the pullies to make a difference?
You're looking at it the wrong way. Those mods aren't going to make the pullies make/release more power. Rather, if you did all those mods at once WITH the pullies at the same time, then you would feel a difference. If you add the pullies alone, even if you have previously installed mods, you might gain (not sure exactly) 5 horsepower and 5 torque. You won't really feel that. However, if you add them with all the other stuff at the same time, it will all add up to be about 20 horsepower (again, not sure exactly on the amount). You will definitely feel 20.

I'd do it anyway.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 05:52:40 PM   #26
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

Decide for yourself. Here are the numbers (depends, but close)

Drop in filter = 0
Tune (depends) = ~15
Exhaust = 2-4
Pulleys = ~2

Tune = Good value
Exhaust = Low value
Pulleys = Low value
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 06:10:27 PM   #27
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

Reading this thread makes me think that I need to get into the business of selling performance parts that don't actually increase performance. Seems like it's a booming business.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 07:06:36 PM   #28
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

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Originally Posted by EmDeeAr View Post
You're looking at it the wrong way. Those mods aren't going to make the pullies make/release more power. Rather, if you did all those mods at once WITH the pullies at the same time, then you would feel a difference. If you add the pullies alone, even if you have previously installed mods, you might gain (not sure exactly) 5 horsepower and 5 torque. You won't really feel that. However, if you add them with all the other stuff at the same time, it will all add up to be about 20 horsepower (again, not sure exactly on the amount). You will definitely feel 20.

I'd do it anyway.
I agree with this. They won't hurt anything. By themselves, they won't do enough for you to feel them. With other mods already, the total may be enough to feel but adding a few horsepower on top won't be anything you can feel.

If you want a more significant mod, find a 3.38 diff from an automatic 96-99M3 to swap in. It will multiply torque a little better -- about 4-5%. Or run a track pipe. Or an M50 intake manifold.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 07:27:26 PM   #29
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

With OBD2 a tune isn't getting more than a couple of HP. Certainly not 15.
All the dyno results without modding anything while installing the tune show
VERY little real change. As to be expected, the car runs a very good tune to begin with. A few degrees of timing or small mixture changes aren't going to net much. This assumes the DME has done a learn mode in both cases. The only cheap mods that produce real power are M50 manifold and/or headers. Fan delete will give a few HP too. Larger AFM asc delete should help To really make any more power you need to change the Volumetric Efficiency of the motor.
A map might get you more if the stock map was crap. A map is useful if you make a lot of other changes. Then a different Ignition base map might be an advantage. Fuel curves are only affected if you are near the edge of the range of the DME. Otherwise, it learns and will make a base map based on the changes.

Maps only help if you make a lot of mods. Don't waste your money on a map with a stock or near stock car.
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Old Mon, Dec-05-2011, 08:41:11 PM   #30
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Default Re: Underdrive Power Pulleys

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Originally Posted by bremms View Post
With OBD2 a tune isn't getting more than a couple of HP. Certainly not 15.
I agree with everything you said, but the guy I was talking to has a 95, and a tune with OBDI can get up to 15 HP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tbaker474 View Post
Reading this thread makes me think that I need to get into the business of selling performance parts that don't actually increase performance. Seems like it's a booming business.
I agree. Maybe we can find a couple pallets of Chinese blower motors and pass them off as electric super chargers. Big money to be made there as well.

I find all this interest in these minimalist "upgrades" to be laughable. You can reach the same benefit of the UD pulleys, for example, by doing an ASC delete with a good drop-in filter. Neither is going to achieve much, but one is about 1/5th the cost of the other. Oh well, to each his own.
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Discussing Underdrive Power Pulleys in the E36 M3 (1992-1999) Forum - {Euro - S50 B32 321hp @ 7400 rpm} {U.S. - S52 B32 240 hp @ 6000 rpm}
Total Produced: 71,212 - Years Produced: 1992 to 1999 at BMW M3 Forum.com (E30 M3 | E36 M3 | E46 M3 | E92 M3 | F80/X)