[Silver46]

Hi. Anyone try a different tuning option such as HPF Aem plug in unit or Pro EFI for the VF kits? Im curious if there is more TQ and power to be gained as the VF graphs ESS seam to be AlphaN or something very simplistic. The HPF setups are running more boost as well as seams to take advantage of the VE of the engine better.

I might purchase one of these ecus and test it on my dyno with the VF SC setup.

Thanks.

[pbonsalb]

I did not know HPF was tuning centrifugal superchargers now. The HPF kits that I am aware of for these cars are turbo kits and they run less boost on pump gas without meth than the centrifugal kits from ESS, AA, Gintani, and VFE.

ESS and VFE are conservative with the peak boost levels. Gintani and AA run higher peak boost on their highest level supercharger kits (but the AA boost level is on a smaller HKS supercharger).

The torque problem on centrifugal superchargers is the lack of midrange boost. If a centrifugal makes 9 psi peak boost, it makes that boost only at the 8000 rpm redline, and produces roughly the square root of peak boost or 3 psi at half peak rpm or 4000 rpm. On a car with weak low end torque to begin with, like the E46M3, you still have to use high rpm to get the big power.

With an aftermarket ECU, you could do an additional meth dependent tune that bumped the ignition timing. But what happens if the meth injection system fails? Would the timing be pulled back quickly enough by the stock ECU to preserve the engine?

Unfortunately, unlike with a turbo, you cannot easily raise the boost. You would have to change the pulley on the supercharger. For a failsafe, on some ECU, you could program a lower rpm limit if the meth failed, so the supercharger could not make the peak boost that would be dangerous without the meth. Likewise, you would want a meth kit that monitors meth flow and has a failsafe output to the ECU. Something like the Aquamist HFS4.

More ignition timing and more boost would wake up the car. The question is the risk involved. HPF does it for turbos (but has the electronic boost controller raise the boost, which is easy and not permanent). So far none of the centrifugal supercharger tuners have done a meth dependent tune, probably because they do not want the liability. What they do for people looking for maximum performance is rebuild the engine with lower compression pistons so it can safely handle more boost, and then they run more boost all of the time. Not cheap to rebuild the engine, though.

You could also just raise the boost on the Vortech supercharger you have and see what happens. This may simply be using up the safety margins that VFE and ESS leave. Gintani does this and the Gintani cars have been among the fastest centrifugal supercharged E46M3s.

[Silver46]

Thanks. I think i will crank the boost up a bit and log knock feedback etc. good point on the peak boost didnt even think of that

[Silver46]

Whats the most boost people have ran on the VF570 setups ?

[BMtroubleyou]

Well..............I have seen up to 13PSI on mine 2 weeks ago, and i run meth too!! POWER to the ground? I don,t know yet but I can tell you that I ran a few and embarrassed those few!

[IHCrusader]

Man, I can't wait to get my VF420 kit installed. BMtroubleyou how is life in KS? I think the only time I saw your car in person was at the TFO car show.

[BevsM3]

Why won't AA, ESS, etc. tune according to the customers needs/wants. If your motor blows with there standard tune the will not warranty it anyway.
What about that company Technica?? (not sure if thats the correct name) I heard they will tune to your liking.
I'll try and find out more info, I know my installer mentioned them before.

[BevsM3]

Originally Posted by BMtroubleyou

Well..............I have seen up to 13PSI on mine 2 weeks ago, and i run meth too!! POWER to the ground? I don,t know yet but I can tell you that I ran a few and embarrassed those few!

Get on that Dyno!!!

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by BevsM3

Why won't AA, ESS, etc. tune according to the customers needs/wants. If your motor blows with there standard tune the will not warranty it anyway.
What about that company Technica?? (not sure if thats the correct name) I heard they will tune to your liking.
I'll try and find out more info, I know my installer mentioned them before.

They don't want the bad reputation that comes when customers blow up cars wth their parts. Might happen occasionally with a safety margin tune. Would happen much more with a radical and risky tune. AA has done some one-off high performance tuning, but wants to have your car in Florida at its shop.

Technica does not do E46M3s yet as far as I know. Technique Tuning can, but I don't think it is interested in centrifugal E46M3. It is helping with a turbo kit for the E46M3. It would also want your car and is also in Florida. OE Tuning has done some custom tuning and its tunes can be done from a few locations around the country. It seems to have some affiliation with Gintani but I don't know all the details. It has tuned some Vortech based centrifugal kits at 14-15 psi.

Just bear in mind that there is a risk when the compression ratio is 11.5:1 and you are running 15 psi peak boost and the meth fails. The effective compression ratio is really too much for 93 pump. Definitely way too much for 91 pump gas. You want a failsafe with the meth and it has to trigger something to make things safe (like a lower redline for less boost), but apparently this cannot be done with the stock ECU.

[Tchleung]

Originally Posted by BevsM3

Why won't AA, ESS, etc. tune according to the customers needs/wants. If your motor blows with there standard tune the will not warranty it anyway.
What about that company Technica?? (not sure if thats the correct name) I heard they will tune to your liking.
I'll try and find out more info, I know my installer mentioned them before.

ESS does custom tuning if you ask and assume all responsibility if anything happens. They charge by the hour.