Maybe another car to add to the contender list for the next M3.

Went to the taste of Lexus event today but didn't get to drive the IS-F (only the IS 350). However they did have a model in the showcase area. Employees told me (without my mention) that it is decidedly faster than the new M3. They boasted about its conservatively estimated 416 hp, 372 torque, 8speed whatchamacallit paddle shift transmission, and ceramic brakes. Being polite but somewhat smug I asked about the near 3800lb. weight but they thought the car "handled the weight fine". Price is low $60's with generously equipped as standard.

I don't know if they're trained to make those claims about the M3 or if it's just amateur Lexus display employees giving their biased opinion, but the numbers don't sound too bad. However, even if the performance is close, for the comparable price is there really a decision? ///M all the way!

More pics available if there is interest.

http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n127/yemenmocha/Lexus%20Event/IMG_1495.jpg
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n127/yemenmocha/Lexus%20Event/IMG_1500.jpg
http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n127/yemenmocha/Lexus%20Event/IMG_1504.jpg

Wrong folder. :wave:

Read the reviews. It's a fine car, but no M3.

Sorry for the wrong folder. Thought it was at home in the e92 M3 vs. (insert car) category for which there are many other such threads there in that folder that are not moved.

Well the new Car and Driver tests show that this is a contender after all! The car matches the M3 in acceleration all the way to 150mph! Very impressive braking and handling as well. Shame it has that ugly tacked on looking side skirt body kit......Good effort from the new F division of Lexus.

I would take the E92 M3 over the IS-F anyday. The IS-F looks "cheap", too plain.

i like it...the quad tips are the only part im unsure about.

but it did the slamom at 71.6 mph...its the fastest saloon tested...certainly up there near the ranks of 911s and the boxster and cayman...

it also runs 0-150 mph in about 24-25 sec (same as the m3)
0-100 in high 9s to low 10s
and traps about 114.

the build quality is going to be up there with Porsche and audi and realiability will be six too. the article i read says they did a helluva a job on their frst sports car and will def be a very good contender that does everything well and it sound sick according to the article. im gonna check it out, as i have a friend whos buying one in the spring.

not digging the interior... seats are nice tho

i would personally drive the new is-f than a e92 m3. just because i love lexus. :x

Are you kidding me??? There would be at least 5 more cars I would consider buying before even thinking about this one, umm I would never get this , auto FTL

Are you kidding me??? There would be at least 5 more cars I would consider buying before even thinking about this one, umm I would never get this , auto FTL

really? youre also saying that the m3 with DCT is FTL. its the same principal, no foot operated clutch.

i think besides the exhaust (which can be fixed with aftermarket) lexus did most everything right IMO with this car.

8 speed paddle shift with short gearing
all the amenities you could ever ask for
styled nicely (again, save for the exhaust)
its got a fantastic engine too with plenty of power and torque
and it handles very well, and in the case of the slalom, i doubt any of its competitors will beat that 71.6 mph

this is lexus' first sports car and they seem to have hit on all the points that the market conditions are demanding.

really? youre also saying that the m3 with DCT is FTL. its the same principal, no foot operated clutch.

i think besides the exhaust (which can be fixed with aftermarket) lexus did most everything right IMO with this car.

8 speed paddle shift with short gearing
all the amenities you could ever ask for
styled nicely (again, save for the exhaust)
its got a fantastic engine too with plenty of power and torque
and it handles very well, and in the case of the slalom, i doubt any of its competitors will beat that 71.6 mph

this is lexus' first sports car and they seem to have hit on all the points that the market conditions are demanding.

Yeh, I would not buy SMG, DCT, DSG, Tiptornic....

Come on man you would not buy this car either and you know it. You may have better luck arguing porsche > BMW than Lexus > BMW

No comparison PERIOD.

I was #4 on the list at a local dealership. It was either the IS-F or an M3. I just recently made up my mind & decided to get an M3. My main reason was if they're going to be the same price (which they will be w/in a few thousand-dollars apart) then I rather have a BMW for the driver feel. I've had both Lexus & BMW in the very recent past & here's what I conclude:

1) Lexus has much better customer service pre & post purchase

2) BMW's always have better driver feel

3) Lexus has much better reliability

4) There's something about driving a BMW that makes you feel special compared to a Lexus. Then again this reason might be another variation of #2

I figured whatever I get between the 2 cars, it'll be my weekend toy so reliability doesn't really matter as much compared to a daily driver. :D Plus, it goes back to driver feel...there's something special about physically driving a BMW that sets it apart from Lexus (I'm not talking about snoob/name appeal either). I know Porsche makes a great sports car too (911 CS) but that's at least $20k more & I can't justify that for a weekend toy especially if it has the same or marginally better performance than an M3.

BTW, I went to the Taste of Lexus event here in Dallas a month ago & the IS-F was there too but it didn't have the optional ceramic brakes (this event was before the F-division announcement at SEMA). An employee started the IS-F up & revved it a few times...WOW, that car's loud but in an all-motor deep v8 growl type of way! :thumbsup: Oh well...

Are you kidding me??? There would be at least 5 more cars I would consider buying before even thinking about this one, umm I would never get this , auto FTL

Yeah, it's disappointing that it only comes in an automatic. However, this auto is definitely one of the best auto transmissions out there... it locks its torque converter in every gear except 1st and it has gearchanges that rival the F430 in speed. Car rags have loved it... Redline is a little low for my tastes (6800?) but I read that Toyota execs didn't want to sell a car that couldn't go past 200k easily... and I suppose cutting the redline and coupling it to an automatic prevents a lot of potential engine problems from developing.

I'm glad they are making it though. More competition means better cars for everyone regardless of what brand they choose.

Yeh, I would not buy SMG, DCT, DSG, Tiptornic....

Come on man you would not buy this car either and you know it. You may have better luck arguing porsche > BMW than Lexus > BMW

im not saying either car is better, just competitors.
i think if i needed a small 4 door sedan, it would come down to the lexus or the c63 most likely. im sure the new m3s are still fun to drive but the styling isnt for me as ive said and thats my deterrent. either way lexus has made a very good car.

Say what you want to about Lexus but if this is their FIRST attempt and they are serious about "The Relentless Pursuit of Perfection". I think BMW, Audi and Mercedes are in for a wake up call.

BMW, the reason why lexus is in "the relentless pursuit of perfection"

BMW, the reason why lexus is in "the relentless pursuit of perfection"

youve got to give this to them tho, they have better build quality, reliability and initial quality than bmw.

youve got to give this to them tho, they have better build quality, reliability and initial quality than bmw.

yet that's not enough when you went out to buy your car, why?

hint: You value the driving dynamics of the car more than the aforementioned items.

yet that's not enough when you went out to buy your car, why?

hint: You value the driving dynamics of the car more than the aforementioned items.

im not saying it is, but have u ever driven an is350...its a fun car given thats its paddle shift, and i can only imagine that the is-f is gonna be a riot based on my experiences with the lower level car. the new bmws arent for me (looks wise not performance) so for a practical car my eye looks towards the competitors.

while i know im not going to buy the new m3 unless i can have the whole body kit redone with aftermarket stuff (which doesnt look promising seeign what ive seen), ill check it out in the flesh and drive it to substantiate, but i dont like the feel of the m5/m6 so i am guessing im prob not gonna like the feel of the new m3. the driving dynamics arent to my liking...for me its Porsche that you just can beat the driving dynamics as well as ferrari and lambo. short of those cars bmw m car provide the next best driving dynamics.

i like a car that thrills you from the start up, when youre going 10 mph or 100+ mph.

im not saying it is, but have u ever driven an is350...its a fun car given thats its paddle shift, and i can only imagine that the is-f is gonna be a riot based on my experiences with the lower level car. the new bmws arent for me (looks wise not performance) so for a practical car my eye looks towards the competitors.

while i know im not going to buy the new m3 unless i can have the whole body kit redone with aftermarket stuff (which doesnt look promising seeign what ive seen), ill check it out in the flesh and drive it to substantiate, but i dont like the feel of the m5/m6 so i am guessing im prob not gonna like the feel of the new m3. the driving dynamics arent to my liking...for me its Porsche that you just can beat the driving dynamics as well as ferrari and lambo. short of those cars bmw m car provide the next best driving dynamics.

i like a car that thrills you from the start up, when youre going 10 mph or 100+ mph.

Man, I had an IS250 for a few days as a loaner and that was an incredible daily driver... tight chassis, wonderfully revvy engine (although it sounded like a sewing machine), great fuel mileage, incredible build quality....... best of all it is $30k flat with lots of options locally once negotiated (MSRP $35,600)... Lexus packs their cars' MSRP full of profit that can be easily negotiated away... the handling balance was too much biased towards understeer though... only complaint on an otherwise AWESOME car.

I test drove an IS350 and hated it. It was a non-nav equipped model, so the IS-F will certainly have a nicer ip. The one I drove had some crappy clear plastic used on the radio and climate control displays that reminded me of a Toyota Sienna's IP. Yes it's fast, but I had no fun in it. I had so much more fun in my slower E36 M3 Sedan(POS Automatic). Maybe it's just me, but to me the IS is a stylish appliance to get from point A to point B. It's fast, handles decently but it is not engaging at all. Based on this, I assume the IS-F is no different, great car, awesome power, quick..but lacking the involvement one gets used to when driving an M

Man, I had an IS250 for a few days as a loaner and that was an incredible daily driver... tight chassis, wonderfully revvy engine (although it sounded like a sewing machine), great fuel mileage, incredible build quality....... best of all it is $30k flat with lots of options locally once negotiated (MSRP $35,600)... Lexus packs their cars' MSRP full of profit that can be easily negotiated away... the handling balance was too much biased towards understeer though... only complaint on an otherwise AWESOME car.

i was in one a few months ago with an exhaust and it sounded phenomenal! it was an is350.

my buddy has a newer 430? the V8 sedan...

he said he wished he never road in my car...makes his seem like a sloppy boat...

Are you kidding me??? There would be at least 5 more cars I would consider buying before even thinking about this one, umm I would never get this , auto FTL


Yeah, it's disappointing that it only comes in an automatic. However, this auto is definitely one of the best auto transmissions out there... it locks its torque converter in every gear except 1st and it has gearchanges that rival the F430 in speed. Car rags have loved it... Redline is a little low for my tastes (6800?) but I read that Toyota execs didn't want to sell a car that couldn't go past 200k easily... and I suppose cutting the redline and coupling it to an automatic prevents a lot of potential engine problems from developing.

I'm glad they are making it though. More competition means better cars for everyone regardless of what brand they choose.


I'm not sure about Rez (Speak up for yourself Rez! :blah: ), but I admit to being very biased in favor of MT's.

With no disrespect intended to either Lexus, which has obviously produced a fine car in the IS-F, nor anyone who has little or no use for MT's, if knowing that a car is equipped with the best automatic in industry is supposed to increase its appeal to some people, including myself, would it be too much to think of the "best auto" as the best looking shemale of a lot of them as a "real" alternative to a female proper when femmes are absolutely preferred? :D

I'm not sure about Rez (Speak up for yourself Rez! :blah: ), but I admit to being very biased in favor of MT's.

With no disrespect intended to either Lexus, which has obviously produced a fine car in the IS-F, nor anyone who has little or no use for MT's, if knowing that a car is equipped with the best automatic in industry is supposed to increase its appeal to some people, including myself, would it be too much to think of the "best auto" as the best looking shemale of a lot of them as a "real" alternative to a female proper when femmes are absolutely preferred? :D

Likewise... the auto is a deal breaker for me in a performance car, especially one without an LSD... but it's one of the best auto's I've driven. Just recognizing where someone has done a good job.

Sadly at this rate the prospects are bleak I hope we don't get to the point where they won't be any females (manual transmission cars) left!!! We'll see how many DSG vs. Manual M3's are sold but I imagine if they sell way more DSG's than manuals and no one else offers a manual they may be tempted not to offer one in the next revision (especially since the manual is no longer the basis for the automated-manual as it was in the E46). That would be a sad day indeed.

Looks like a great car! Read many reviews and all of of the ones I've read really loved the car including Car and Driver, so go figure, lol! They say it's unlike all Lexuses, in which, is purely luxury, no feel, boring, etc...

And most of all, the mags praised the steering feel and handling. Props to Lexus on their first outing on making a fine automobile even though I know many Euro guys won't give them a chance nor credit for whatever reason:thumbsup:

I'm not sure about Rez (Speak up for yourself Rez! :blah: ), but I admit to being very biased in favor of MT's.

With no disrespect intended to either Lexus, which has obviously produced a fine car in the IS-F, nor anyone who has little or no use for MT's, if knowing that a car is equipped with the best automatic in industry is supposed to increase its appeal to some people, including myself, would it be too much to think of the "best auto" as the best looking shemale of a lot of them as a "real" alternative to a female proper when femmes are absolutely preferred? :D

Yup, no shemales for me :laughhard:

I got a ride in a friends IS 350 and hated it. Personally I thought even the interior, where lexus is supposed to shine, was crappy and cheap plastic. That car does nothing for me, we considered it for the wife but I didn't even want it for my wife :thumbsdown: She drives a manual TSX, if she be a good girl, maybe a BMW next

I picked up an IS350 for my wife last year and anyone that thinks that Lexus cannot make an entertaining and enjoyable car is misinformed. I've run the car at the track a couple of time and it runs mid 13s @102-103 right out of the box. Furthermore, while it does not have the finesse of an E46 M3 the car is a joy to drive on winding roads.

I can only imagine what the IS-F will be like to drive? I bet it will be a rocket and at least mirror or exceed what the new M3 will do on the road.

I do agree that the interior materials of the IS350 are not on the same level as the E46 M3. I'm anxious to see what the E92's interior is all about. I hope it is a step forward. The pictures I've seen make me a bit concerned but we'll have to wait to see the final product.

BTW, The assss of the IS-F looks like shiittt.:thumbsdown:

I picked up an IS350 for my wife last year and anyone that thinks that Lexus cannot make an entertaining and enjoyable car is misinformed. I've run the car at the track a couple of time and it runs mid 13s @102-103 right out of the box. Furthermore, while it does not have the finesse of an E46 M3 the car is a joy to drive on winding roads.

I can only imagine what the IS-F will be like to drive? I bet it will be a rocket and at least mirror or exceed what the new M3 will do on the road.

I do agree that the interior materials of the IS350 are not on the same level as the E46 M3. I'm anxious to see what the E92's interior is all about. I hope it is a step forward. The pictures I've seen make me a bit concerned but we'll have to wait to see the final product.

BTW, The assss of the IS-F looks like shiittt.:thumbsdown:

well the is-f so far from what ive seen matches the m3 in every statistical way....0-100, 0-150, it slaloms faster, breaking is there too. i agree the exhaust treatment needs to be fixed, but other than that i like it.

I believe that the IS-F will be a force to be reckon with. Many have commented on the 350, but this will not be the same car. Let's give Lexus some credit on a job well done on their first try. It will only raise the bar for the other manufacturers, ending in our benefit.

Lexus is very serious as far as their F series goes. I believe is 5 years or so, we will see them on par or better than some of the German counterparts. As always, there will be tuners that will make this car a beast. Toyota/Lexus almost always leaves room for more tuning. As mentioned in an earlier post, they are conservative - it may be another Supra, a tuners dream.

What is disturbing to me, is how many have said that this car isn't a drivers car without driving it. My question is, how many truly know how to drive or have been to the track at all? Some here are true enthusiasts, but not many. Last time I was at the track, I saw only a few BMW M3 drivers, but a ton of EVO/STi drivers.

My point is, the argument of a Lexus not being a drivers car seems to be based solely on image and not car & driver merit. I would hope that we can make some logical / unbiased comments on future cars that would challenge the venerable M3. Not just dismiss any contender for any reason possible because we've been drinking the M3 Kool-Aid for far too long.

I believe that the IS-F will be a force to be reckon with. Many have commented on the 350, but this will not be the same car. Let's give Lexus some credit on a job well done on their first try. It will only raise the bar for the other manufacturers, ending in our benefit.

Lexus is very serious as far as their F series goes. I believe is 5 years or so, we will see them on par or better than some of the German counterparts. As always, there will be tuners that will make this car a beast. Toyota/Lexus almost always leaves room for more tuning. As mentioned in an earlier post, they are conservative - it may be another Supra, a tuners dream.

What is disturbing to me, is how many have said that this car isn't a drivers car without driving it. My question is, how many truly know how to drive or have been to the track at all? Some here are true enthusiasts, but not many. Last time I was at the track, I saw only a few BMW M3 drivers, but a ton of EVO/STi drivers.

My point is, the argument of a Lexus not being a drivers car seems to be based solely on image and not car & driver merit. I would hope that we can make some logical / unbiased comments on future cars that would challenge the venerable M3. Not just dismiss any contender for any reason possible because we've been drinking the M3 Kool-Aid for far too long.

Post of the year! :thumbsup2::thumbsup2::thumbsup2:

Thanks for coming out and saying it. :woohoo:

Putting down the competition doesn't make the M3 better... and it's the IS-F along with the C63 and RS4 that give BMW the *reason* to work so hard on the M3.

Yup, no shemales for me :laughhard:

I got a ride in a friends IS 350 and hated it. Personally I thought even the interior, where lexus is supposed to shine, was crappy and cheap plastic. That car does nothing for me, we considered it for the wife but I didn't even want it for my wife :thumbsdown: She drives a manual TSX, if she be a good girl, maybe a BMW next

Really? I thought the materials were great... even though the BMW had slightly better "build quality" (i.e. center console on the BMW was definitely more solid). I had a loaner 2007 IS250 that I beat on for a few days. I was extremely impressed with the materials and thought they were a good deal better than what I found when I had a loaner 2007 328i the next day which felt like the "cheaper" car to me. The IS250 had leather vs. leatherette and power/heated/cooled seats vs. basic manual seats on the E90, and the dash materials/vinyl felt like they were higher quality... it also had gear paddles on the steering wheel and a very impressive/stylish instrument cluster with a user-set speed warning. Compared to the E90 which was in my opinion "stripped" but the same price, I would definitely choose the IS250... only place where I really liked the BMW more was handling balance. The BMW was much easier to throttle steer with its standard 17" wheels and A/S tires and was wonderfully progressive at the limit in slide control and recovery. The IS250 has staggered tires which induce a little bit of understeer at the limit which means the car pushes in all but the slowest corners. The BMW also sounds louder and better... in the IS250 you can barely hear the engine which I suppose some customers may like... not me though. The IS-F will clearly be different. ;)

Looks like a great car! Read many reviews and all of of the ones I've read really loved the car including Car and Driver, so go figure, lol! They say it's unlike all Lexuses, in which, is purely luxury, no feel, boring, etc...

And most of all, the mags praised the steering feel and handling. Props to Lexus on their first outing on making a fine automobile even though I know many Euro guys won't give them a chance nor credit for whatever reason:thumbsup:

Agreed... overall, I think it's a great package and a worthy competitor especially if C&D is spot on with their review of the car's performance. I don't know so much about the rear exhaust tips but there are many areas to nit pick on basically any car's styling... I'm concerned about Edmunds' review considering they said it was too *stiff* though... that would be a first for a Lexus.

In fact, I'm buying my grandma an IS250 tomorrow to replace her BMW 528i & to complement my grandpa's X5 V8. LOL... how ironic. Oh well. :shiftdriv

I acutally havnt read a review yet....I guess I should...

I guess the proof will be int he driving of these cars back to back. This board seems to have people saying that the C63, GT-R and now IS-F cannot handle as well as the new M3, or steer as well? Who has driven all of them together to make that assumption? Not me. This new Lexus looks like it is in the M3's ballpark, with similar performance, and for less money with a better build quality reputation. It does not yet have BMW's legendary handling reputation, but all reports indicate that this is a very different Lexus. I will definitely give it a look, but I wish it came with a 6 speed manual, and a better looking rear end as well......

I guess the proof will be int he driving of these cars back to back. This board seems to have people saying that the C63, GT-R and now IS-F cannot handle as well as the new M3, or steer as well? Who has driven all of them together to make that assumption? Not me. This new Lexus looks like it is in the M3's ballpark, with similar performance, and for less money with a better build quality reputation. It does not yet have BMW's legendary handling reputation, but all reports indicate that this is a very different Lexus. I will definitely give it a look, but I wish it came with a 6 speed manual, and a better looking rear end as well......

well here are slalom times for both the new m3 and the lexus is-f

lexus is-f-71.6 mph
m3-65.9 mph

5.7 mph (8.65%) faster than the m3 in which 2-3 mph is a substantial amount of mph in the slalom which is good for info on handling, and change of direction of a car.
so if you think the m3 handles well, what does this say about the is-f?

well here are slalom times for both the new m3 and the lexus is-f

lexus is-f-71.6 mph
m3-65.9 mph

5.7 mph (8.65%) faster than the m3 in which 2-3 mph is a substantial amount of mph in the slalom which is good for info on handling, and change of direction of a car.
so if you think the m3 handles well, what does this say about the is-f?

Looks like it is faster than 911, you should buy one :thumbsup2:

well here are slalom times for both the new m3 and the lexus is-f

lexus is-f-71.6 mph
m3-65.9 mph

5.7 mph (8.65%) faster than the m3 in which 2-3 mph is a substantial amount of mph in the slalom which is good for info on handling, and change of direction of a car.
so if you think the m3 handles well, what does this say about the is-f?

Are are u serious......that slalom speed for the IS-F looks a litte bit over the top. I mean, that is Cayman S/ 997 GT3/ Lotus extige territory if I remember correctly. If thats true that thing must have near slicks on it....

Are are u serious......that slalom speed for the IS-F looks a litte bit over the top. I mean, that is Cayman S/ 997 GT3/ Lotus extige territory if I remember correctly. If thats true that thing must have near slicks on it....

the 997 C4S i believe slaloms 71.8 mph and ive seen as high as 73.X for the cayman S...and the CGT is around 72-73 mph as well. the lexus is up there, it was said to be the fastest saloon theyve tested, and that says a lot considering there are so many performance saloons out there now.

Looks like it is faster than 911, you should buy one :thumbsup2:

it looks like i would make a great daily driver.

911 slalom stats

997S-71.7
997C4S-71.8
Cayman S-73.6 (highest i remember seeing)
CGT-72-73 mph
Boxster S-73.9

so the is-f is very close and about even with a couple, and we all know how well Porsches handle, and i think it says a tremendous amount about the is-f's handling. anything over 70 mph is considered extremely good, and the is-f is well over that mark along with the elite list above (plus a few other sports/exotics).

it looks like i would make a great daily driver.

911 slalom stats

997S-71.7
997C4S-71.8
Cayman S-73.6 (highest i remember seeing)
CGT-72-73 mph
Boxster S-73.9

so the is-f is very close and about even with a couple, and we all know how well Porsches handle, and i think it says a tremendous amount about the is-f's handling. anything over 70 mph is considered extremely good, and the is-f is well over that mark along with the elite list above (plus a few other sports/exotics).

so are you going to get one?

so are you going to get one?

not sure...i have a friend whos getting one (has a lexus is right now) so im gonna check his out when he gets it. im def impressed by it tho thus far.

it looks like i would make a great daily driver.

911 slalom stats

997S-71.7
997C4S-71.8
Cayman S-73.6 (highest i remember seeing)
CGT-72-73 mph
Boxster S-73.9

so the is-f is very close and about even with a couple, and we all know how well Porsches handle, and i think it says a tremendous amount about the is-f's handling. anything over 70 mph is considered extremely good, and the is-f is well over that mark along with the elite list above (plus a few other sports/exotics).

link to the tests...

the tires on the lexus look like semi-slicks...Pilot something

todays Roundel...
average BMW buyer age 45
Lexus 52
ES350 61

link to the tests...

the tires on the lexus look like semi-slicks...Pilot something

todays Roundel...
average BMW buyer age 45
Lexus 52
ES350 61


really? ill check the mag when i get home from this business trip, but im almost positive they were PS2s.

997S and Boxster S-71.7 and 73.6 (respectively)
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/download/0503_best_sports_car_data_panel.pdf

997 C4S (targa)-72.0 mph (997 C4S coupe has done 71.8)
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Followup/articleId=122158

cayman s-73.2
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0511_2006_porsche_cayman_s/handling_exhaust.html

Carrera GT-72.0
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0401_2004_porsche_carrera_gt/specs_price.html

really? ill check the mag when i get home from this business trip, but im almost positive they were PS2s.

997S and Boxster S-71.7 and 73.6 (respectively)
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/download/0503_best_sports_car_data_panel.pdf

997 C4S (targa)-72.0 mph (997 C4S coupe has done 71.8)
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/Drives/Followup/articleId=122158

cayman s-73.2
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0511_2006_porsche_cayman_s/handling_exhaust.html

Carrera GT-72.0
http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupe/112_0401_2004_porsche_carrera_gt/specs_price.html

the M3 has never been run on a 700' slalom...

the 65.9 is for a lane change...NOT a 700' steady state slalom...BIG difference...on PS2's...it also pulled 0.91 on a 150' skid pad w/PS2's...no one knows what the 700' speed it...

it did 43 mph on a 59' slalom...it will fly on a 700' ;)

it pulled a 1.25 w/PSC+ vs. a 1.3 for a 997GT3 on PSC's on a g pad...

the M3 has never been run on a 700' slalom...

the 65.9 is for a lane change...NOT a 700' steady state slalom...BIG difference...on PS2's...it also pulled 0.91 on a 150' skid pad w/PS2's...no one knows what the 700' speed it...

it did 43 mph on a 59' slalom...it will fly on a 700' ;)

it pulled a 1.25 w/PSC+ vs. a 1.3 for a 997GT3 on PSC's on a g pad...

not bad. The 911s absolutely kill on skid pads, slaloms and pretty much anything. i doubt the m3 will break 70 mph though. the z4m coupe, bmws most hard core car has achieved 70.5 which is very good, i dont se the any m3 doing it, let along the new one.
what i found impressive, was the is-f was said to be the fastest saloon ever tested, thats all. niether car is better or worse, just different approaches to very similar oriented cars.

Can you believe the Z4M still runs on the ContiSportContact's (225/255) that came with the E46 M3 back in 2001? Jeez.

ISF OEM tires are PS2's... finally Lexus gets serious. Not that PS2's are the stickiest or most responsive street rubber option out there... but they're at least not Bridgestone Turanza ER33's or whatever comes on the standard IS's.. which aren't horrible for summer tires... but definitely not in the same league as the Michelins. ;)

Yes. They were PS2's in this particular test.
Standard the IS-F will be fitted with Michelins (Pilotsport PS2's that is) or Bridgestones, depending on the market.

Sizes are in both cases 225/40 R19 93 Y (8J) front and 255/35 R19 96Y (9J) at the rear

Thanks for the info, ISF-insider. Bridgestone RE050A Pole Position or another tire? Any reason Lexus did not go with wider tires and wider wheels stock (this is the same set up as the E46 M3 and the same width as the standard IS250/IS350 with 18's)?

:shiftdrivPotenza, that is.
Sorry

Thanks for the info, ISF-insider. Bridgestone RE050A Pole Position or another tire? Any reason Lexus did not go with wider tires and wider wheels stock (this is the same set up as the E46 M3 and the same width as the standard IS250/IS350 with 18's)?

i bet a 255 f and 285/295 rear on that car would be sick. im sure there is def gonna be room for way more agressive offsets (even with the BBK on the is-f) and way more rubber.

As you can see on the pics, the wheelarched are pretty much filled.
There is not too much room left for wider tyres, specially at the rear.
But believe me: the standard size is very good for this car.

I sure hope the IS-F looks better in person, because online pics make it look tacky..

Anybody see this....

http://www.thetorquereport.com/2007/12/is_lexus_working_on_a_429_hors.html#more

http://www.thetorquereport.com/isf-thumb.jpg
According to the newest rumors Lexus is working on an even hotter version of its new IS-F sedan.

Winding Road is reporting that Lexus wants to further close the gap between the IS-Fand the BMW M3 and the Mercedes-Benz C63 AMG. The IS-F/R version is going to be powered by a 5.0L Yamaha produced V8 that puts out 429 horsepower and 376 lb-ft of torque. That is up from 417 horsepower and 371 lb-ft of torque in the current IS-F. The "R" version is also going to be lighter by about 220 pounds thanks to carbon fiber and a stripped down interior.



I'm not sure what the IS-F's curb weight is.....might 220 lbs less put it under the M3 weight??? ...wonder how much it will cost.

Anybody see this....

http://www.thetorquereport.com/2007/12/is_lexus_working_on_a_429_hors.html#more

http://www.thetorquereport.com/isf-thumb.jpg


I'm not sure what the IS-F's curb weight is.....might 220 lbs less put it under the M3 weight??? ...wonder how much it will cost.


wow! the is-f weights about 3800 lbs...its already as fast as the m3 at that wieght, but will more hp and 200+ lbs of weight, thats gonna be huge for it. and its been tested as the fastest saloon, so this car def looks to be quite a remarkable accomplishment for lexus. they seem to have gotten the car right on their very first try giving more luxuries than its competitors, just as fast if not faster than eveyrthing except the c63, and handles very very well. i doubt the m3 coupe or sedan could touch the is-f's slalom time. not even the z4m coupe did the slalom as fast as the is-f. impressive to say the least.

Sounds very nice, but perhaps a true 6 speed manual as an option would help some of the doubters go to the Lexus dealer to check out the car.

^^^If that car came with a 6speed manual it would definately be a nice option. It would also cut down on the curb weight a bit more.

The only way to know the success of the car is to see how many lexus will sell to the enthusiast willing to spend its price tag, I doubt that would be too many, certainly not as many as M3, we shall see.

The only way to know the success of the car is to see how many lexus will sell to the enthusiast willing to spend its price tag, I doubt that would be too many, certainly not as many as M3, we shall see.


Honestly I the variant is 65K or less with a manual transmission it would be an awesome option at <3600lbs.

With the power it will produce, that thing is going to move.

Honestly I the variant is 65K or less with a manual transmission it would be an awesome option at <3600lbs.

With the power it will produce, that thing is going to move.

true but you know what it finally comes down to, what the car makes you feel driving it! I remember e36 M3 was always compared with cars much faster and more powerful and often came on top as the car the reviewer or customer wanted to take home at the end of the day. At this point with all these new cars coming out, we just get to judge them by the numbers, the true test will come in a year or so when you actually can drive them back to back aand see for yourself, which one is for you :raspberry:

I am seriously looking at the Lexus IS-F. I can't afford to have 2 cars so whatever I get will be my daily driver. Reliability will be really important but I want performance too. Lexus service is way better (at least down here) and the dealership is closer to my house. BMW does have the scheduled maintenance included though so that should be factored into the price. Out of warrenty service cost an arm and a leg though. My second major service included the brakes and came out to $5000! Thats almost 10% of the base price! I know BMW is the King in driving dynamics, but the Lexus IS-F is getting a serious look before I decide.

The C63 is also a sick car. MB service totally sucks at the stealership closest to me. Appointments are usually 3 weeks out at best. Straight line accel is insane though at under 3 seconds. The Nissan GT-R is going to be even crazier. I think C&D published a estimated time of 3.5 seconds and a top of over 180. If the M3 with options starts getting up there, it isn't that far a reach to pay the estimated $85,000 for the GT-R.

5K for brakes :bugeye: Even if you do inspection II with a brake job it should not cost 5K. I think someone got milked pretty good :whistle:

meh, slalom shmalom. i wanna see what it does on the ring. to me, that track is the true and best test of a cars handling.

meh, slalom shmalom. i wanna see what it does on the ring. to me, that track is the true and best test of a cars handling.

well the slalom is good litmus test at determining how a car handles, its change of direction, as well as grip.

ring times are affected by temp, conditions, tires, etc. so unless two car are run on the same day, same tires, same conditions, its never really apples to apples, but a great indicator of a cars overall capabilities.

i would like to see what the is-f runs as well.

i would like to see what the is-f runs as well.


hopefully runs into a wall.

hopefully a wall.

wtf?!?

well the slalom is good litmus test at determining how a car handles, its change of direction, as well as grip.

ring times are affected by temp, conditions, tires, etc. so unless two car are run on the same day, same tires, same conditions, its never really apples to apples, but a great indicator of a cars overall capabilities.

i would like to see what the is-f runs as well.

There's a time -- 7:24 -- being mentioned that I've seen in at least one forum, but I haven't bothered to check it out since it seems too outlandish. The time is supposedly what an IS-F was clocked around the Ring (North Loop), but so far no one has declared the track to have been wet. :roll:

There's a time -- 7:24 -- being mentioned that I've seen in at least one forum, but I haven't bothered to check it out since it seems too outlandish. The time is supposedly what an IS-F was clocked around the Ring (North Loop), but so far no one has declared the track to have been wet. :roll:

Did they mention if it was on slicks or regular PS2's ??





































:laughhard::laughhard::rofl3:

Regular PS2's.

hopefully runs into a wall.

I Agree :thumbsup2:

^^ U got a Japanese animated character up there, but you wanna demolish one of Japans best attmeps at a sport sedan.

How mean...

I know I would pick the is-f over the new m3 sedan. God it is ugly.

Why don't we wait until the new is-f coupe come out and compare it to the new m3 coupe. Now that is a fair comparison.

I know I would pick the is-f over the new m3 sedan. God it is ugly.

Why don't we wait until the new is-f coupe come out and compare it to the new m3 coupe. Now that is a fair comparison.

I disagree I wouldn't pick a baluga whale looking car over a bland looking car :shifty:

hopefully runs into a wall.


Why? And hopefully it gets you a long the way:roll:

^^:ha:

Why? And hopefully it gets you a long the way

Let's not cross the line. It was a joke, please don't make this personal.

Car and Driver timed 0-60 mph in 4.2 secs, but not all the mags seem to have been able to set this sort of time.
I've seen 4.6; 4.7 and 4.8 too.

From what I've seen in this thread there are quite a few people who just don't want to believe that Lexus can build a decent sports sedan - maybe even refuse to accept that it's possible that it can even come close to the almighty M3. Competition improves the breed for sure and from what I've seen and from the information supplied by ISF-insider and PorscheC4 Lexus definitely has a contender with the IS-F.

Some people just HATE the thought of anything except a full manual transmission and all and I do agree that having a left leg clutch makes the driving experience a bit more involving but SMG is definitely fun and I would think faster around a track as well. I like having the ability to drive my SMG E46 and then when I want a taste of all manual I drive my E36 M3 but when all is said and done if I had money riding on it for the fastest lap time I'd take an SMG equipped car over manual - but that is only *my* opinion.

I guess my point is that it's good to see lots of members keeping an open mind on other products out there. It's nice to be able to commend another manufacturer on a job well done instead of blasting it outright because you don't care for it for one reason or another (sometimes multiple). I'm sure there are people out there who have had a terrible experience with a BMW M3 out there and that may taint their opinion for future purchases.

Difference is what makes the world go 'round. Personally, I'd hate to see EVERYONE out there driving an M3. It would take away from the fun at track days chasing down (or trying) and passing other cars.

Anyway, looks like Lexus has a decent car coming out and I can't wait to see the head-to-head comparisons and driving impressions. Have a great Thursday everyone and be careful out there and drive safely - but have fun.

From what I've seen in this thread there are quite a few people who just don't want to believe that Lexus can build a decent sports sedan - maybe even refuse to accept that it's possible that it can even come close to the almighty M3. Competition improves the breed for sure and from what I've seen and from the information supplied by ISF-insider and PorscheC4 Lexus definitely has a contender with the IS-F.

Some people just HATE the thought of anything except a full manual transmission and all and I do agree that having a left leg clutch makes the driving experience a bit more involving but SMG is definitely fun and I would think faster around a track as well. I like having the ability to drive my SMG E46 and then when I want a taste of all manual I drive my E36 M3 but when all is said and done if I had money riding on it for the fastest lap time I'd take an SMG equipped car over manual - but that is only *my* opinion.

I guess my point is that it's good to see lots of members keeping an open mind on other products out there. It's nice to be able to commend another manufacturer on a job well done instead of blasting it outright because you don't care for it for one reason or another (sometimes multiple). I'm sure there are people out there who have had a terrible experience with a BMW M3 out there and that may taint their opinion for future purchases.

Difference is what makes the world go 'round. Personally, I'd hate to see EVERYONE out there driving an M3. It would take away from the fun at track days chasing down (or trying) and passing other cars.

Anyway, looks like Lexus has a decent car coming out and I can't wait to see the head-to-head comparisons and driving impressions. Have a great Thursday everyone and be careful out there and drive safely - but have fun.

^^^ :thumbsup2:

From what I've seen in this thread there are quite a few people who just don't want to believe that Lexus can build a decent sports sedan - maybe even refuse to accept that it's possible that it can even come close to the almighty M3. Competition improves the breed for sure and from what I've seen and from the information supplied by ISF-insider and PorscheC4 Lexus definitely has a contender with the IS-F.

Some people just HATE the thought of anything except a full manual transmission and all and I do agree that having a left leg clutch makes the driving experience a bit more involving but SMG is definitely fun and I would think faster around a track as well. I like having the ability to drive my SMG E46 and then when I want a taste of all manual I drive my E36 M3 but when all is said and done if I had money riding on it for the fastest lap time I'd take an SMG equipped car over manual - but that is only *my* opinion.

I guess my point is that it's good to see lots of members keeping an open mind on other products out there. It's nice to be able to commend another manufacturer on a job well done instead of blasting it outright because you don't care for it for one reason or another (sometimes multiple). I'm sure there are people out there who have had a terrible experience with a BMW M3 out there and that may taint their opinion for future purchases.

Difference is what makes the world go 'round. Personally, I'd hate to see EVERYONE out there driving an M3. It would take away from the fun at track days chasing down (or trying) and passing other cars.

Anyway, looks like Lexus has a decent car coming out and I can't wait to see the head-to-head comparisons and driving impressions. Have a great Thursday everyone and be careful out there and drive safely - but have fun.

great post:thumbsup2:

From what I've seen in this thread there are quite a few people who just don't want to believe that Lexus can build a decent sports sedan - maybe even refuse to accept that it's possible that it can even come close to the almighty M3. Competition improves the breed for sure and from what I've seen and from the information supplied by ISF-insider and PorscheC4 Lexus definitely has a contender with the IS-F.

Some people just HATE the thought of anything except a full manual transmission and all and I do agree that having a left leg clutch makes the driving experience a bit more involving but SMG is definitely fun and I would think faster around a track as well. I like having the ability to drive my SMG E46 and then when I want a taste of all manual I drive my E36 M3 but when all is said and done if I had money riding on it for the fastest lap time I'd take an SMG equipped car over manual - but that is only *my* opinion.

I guess my point is that it's good to see lots of members keeping an open mind on other products out there. It's nice to be able to commend another manufacturer on a job well done instead of blasting it outright because you don't care for it for one reason or another (sometimes multiple). I'm sure there are people out there who have had a terrible experience with a BMW M3 out there and that may taint their opinion for future purchases.

Difference is what makes the world go 'round. Personally, I'd hate to see EVERYONE out there driving an M3. It would take away from the fun at track days chasing down (or trying) and passing other cars.

Anyway, looks like Lexus has a decent car coming out and I can't wait to see the head-to-head comparisons and driving impressions. Have a great Thursday everyone and be careful out there and drive safely - but have fun.


Good post and people are forgetting that that one of the greatest cars BMW produced was the E46 M3 CSL and that was SMG only and it's safe to say I don't remember anyone ragging on it.

Now that Lexus is going after the M division and such, do you think Infiniti will set up to the plate next... Acura's "TYPE S" cars are no where near in the same league.

Good post and people are forgetting that that one of the greatest cars BMW produced was the E46 M3 CSL and that was SMG only and it's safe to say I don't remember anyone ragging on it.

very true... i wanna hear people complain about not having a manual clutch some more. go complain to the engineers at Ferrari, tell em that f430scaderia, Enzo, FXX and FXX Evolution all need manual clutch.

are you still in high school? do you still brag about driving a car with manual clutch? im the first one to admit that i've said the same thing when i was in high school, but that was in the 90s

Now that Lexus is going after the M division and such, do you think Infiniti will set up to the plate next... Acura's "TYPE S" cars are no where near in the same league.

Good question as neither Infiniti nor Acura have any sports sedan products out there to compete in that market. Could it be that Infiniti/Nissan have been concentrating more on the GT-R and Acura have been concentrating on the HSX (Or whatever they're calling their NSX replacement)?

I think we're fortunate to see all of these engineering feats on the market today. Who would have thought Audi (usually a sports sedan company with some random coupes here and there) would create the R8? I didn't at least.

It's a great time for us and I really look forward to seeing the shoot-outs. That being said, I'll stick with my E46 M3 for quite some time since I'm just too damned poor to get anything else (that I feel would be a worthy replacement that is)!

Thanks indeed AleksT.
I have linked your comment to my website as well.
See http://www.isf-blog.com/

For in-depth requests about the IS-F: ask them at http://www.isf-blog.com/2008/01/is-f-press-laun.html
I will get camera and notebook with me.

That IS-F DTM looks menacing and serious. It looks like it will be an interesting year for motorsports. I'm not in the market for a car right now (okay maybe not but I'm *always* looking) but it looks like there are so many fun and interesting choices. While I'm still in the M3 faithful camp, I'd I wouldn't mind checking out and test driving an IS-F. Okay, I'd really want to go check out an RS4 as well.

hey everybody, long time no see. I picked up an ISF a few weeks ago and it's a lot of fun. I'm sure it's not an M3 (the IS350 was not an E36 M3) but it's a hell of a fun car.

Dave
'99 M3 convertible (gone)
'06 IS350 (gone)
'08 ISF (http://www.dkaplan.com/DavesISF) (not gone)

Ooooohhhh gooood TOPIC. Here are my thoughts. Automatic 7 speed transmission? Please. They should have developed an SMG knock-off, automatic = torque converter. The motor is amazing though, and when people start fiddling with the RZ series even motor, it will be over.

lexsus making performance engines yeah right

lexsus making performance engines yeah right

2jz... yea i thought so:owned:

lexsus making performance engines yeah right


Toyota maybe :roll:

http://www.autocar.co.uk/VideosWallpapers/Videos.aspx?AR=232030&CT=V


IS-F versus M3, C63....:thumbsup2:

Alright..uhm
Yeah if your a lexus love you'll get the is-f if your true to bmw you'll get the m3 problem solved lol..

ive never been a big fan of lexus....

lexus makes great cars that are much more reliable than bimmers (and better service), but there are 3 HUGE reasons why i would take the M3 over the lexus.

lack of a manual tranny, lack of an LSD, and they don't offer a coupe.

luxury sports car? no thanks
M3 > ISF anyday.

first of all i am an extreme lexus IS series and bmw M series lover !!! no other brands for ME!!!

well if you want performance i would suggest you choose the M3 over the IS F, why you might ask?

the IS F is faster than the M3, but only in a long run in a straight road. partly thanks for the 8 gears ( to save gas). At turning the IS F is considerably slower than the M3. M3 is purely for the exterior look and performance, and the name of M3 is enough to make a lot of people say " DAM nice car" . The M3 has the reputation which the lexus IS series couldn't match. CAN BE MODDED FOR MORE POWER. you will have issues with the M3, costs a good amount of paper( money) for maintenance.

if you want luxurious comfort and speed at the sametime i would suggest you buying the IS F. needless to say the keyless entry ( u can open the doors without pulling ur keys out of your pocket), Ventilated seats ( both warm and cold included, truely Godly for places like SF, where the weathers are so unpredictable), comfortable seats and navigation system, truely luxurious ! Excellent reliablity

( PS: just so you know, if your a speed freak, the IS series are known to be impossible to be modded for a considerable gain in horsepower yet, unless you throw in a whole fortune, litterally a whole fortune.) i heard some was successfully Supercharged a IS 350 in japan but good luck with that XD!

currently i am considering on buying a car, my dilimma would be between the lexus IS 350 and the 2004 E46 M3. as the gas price keeps going up, i am more convinced to buy the IS 350 now, also my tons of driving tickets. XD

hope you will have a better ideas about both cars now !

here ya go

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LfJcpntrrck

lexsus making performance engines yeah right

hahaha

I test drove the following when i was looking to upgrade from my 335:

2008 Lexus ISF
2008 Mercedes C63 AMG
2008 BMW M3
2008 Audi RS4

Getting back on topic though there really is a HUGE differance between the "feel" and handling of the M3 versus the ISF. The ISF felt allot softer in aggressive cornering and over all ride.
It reminded me of my friend who has a 2006 MB SL500 always griping about how "rough of a ride" my M3 is.

The Lexus was nice car but it felt/handled very similar to the MB in that it felt like a luxury car first with sport added in after.
Anyway that's my 2 cents! :)

I read all 11 pages and I don't agree with much of what's been said.

I spent a day at Skip Barber driving an LS-F around the track. It's a great car. I'm not sure what's up with all the Lexus hate, they have great customer service and build reliable cars that are relatively inexpensive to own & maintain. I've also spent some time flogging an E92 M3, though not at a track.

The LS-F is not exactly a track weapon but neither is the new M3. They're both big, heavy, powerful cars. My :twocents:, the IS-F has a slightly more luxurious feeling interior, the M3 has better road feel and prestige. Magazine tests and bench racing are almost useless, there's not much objective difference between them. It's strictly a subjective, personal choice about style.

If it were my money, I'd by an S5.